How much do you spend on promoting?

I would guess that many first-time authors expected the publisher to do all the promotional work. All one had to do was sit back and wait for the royalty checks. Joining an author's forum was an education. Following similar paths taken by other authors seemed to be the way to go. Book signings, buying promotional bookmarkers, etc. It worked for some but not for others.
With a second book, there should be no surprises. Realizing that one must promote to sell should be accepted. It takes time, effort and money. For those not willing to invest in their work, it is foolish to seek publication.

Somewhere here there was a link to a journal that told the number of people being published, the number of books being sold, versus the number of books being submitted. The numbers being submitted are astronomical. Our chances of being published by traditional publishers with sales of thousands are slim. The authors here have published some of the best books I have ever read. They have tried for contracts from publishers large and small.

Publication of my military book written by an unknown woman with no bars or stars is next to impossible, but I realize the interest I have gotten from publishers is positive and I should keep trying.

I have already done promotion for that book. My sister-in-law designed a cover that can be viewed on my website. She magically captures what my books are about without reading them. Then we developed a poster, had it printed by a man in our town, and my daughter also made up a brochure, and I went to my husband's squadron reunion in Florida and was the featured speaker. We were going to the reunion anyway. I paid my sister-in-law and printed the brochure on my in home printer.

Being unfamous is all right, but I also believe I have written something worthwhile. Instead of just dreaming and being told we need those big contracts, which just aren't numerous enough for all the great authors here or elsewhere, we need to look at the future, be part of the solution.

As Shelagh has pointed out the value of a thread, of a messageboard, we need to believe we can make a difference in this industry, have a purpose, and keep writing and finding readers, promoting both writing and reading.

Love, Carol

BTW, my sister-in-law is a professional graphic artist and my daughter is a technical writer for the university with a degree in marketing.

Carol

LC, I respect your experiences and know it comes from a history of being published.

Authors without major deals still need to promote. Two former iUniverse books are out and coming out from major publishers now after the authors went forward under their own steam. one is Still Alice which hit the NYT bestsellers list, another is Hollywood Car Wash:

Still Alice - amazon

Hollywood Car Wash - amazon

These are excerts from an email that I received:

'Mr. Pollard,

I represent Recorded Books, the world’s largest publisher of unabridged audio books.

Having fielded several librarian requests, I am interested in acquiring audio rights to ROOFTOP DIVA.

I look forward to hearing from you.'

Library Holdings - Rooftop Diva

I am not saying that an independent author will be able to match a publisher's results using self-promotion, it could lead to other opportunities. Sometimes proving your book's marketability can yield other positive results. To not try is to ensure low returns.

Quote :

Who wants to be famous anyway?

Me!

<< I also believe
I have written something worthwhile. Instead of just dreaming and being
told we need those big contracts, which just aren't numerous enough for
all the great authors here or elsewhere, we need to look at the future,
be part of the solution. >>

Carol, I didn't mean to imply that those without commercial contracts don't have worthwhile work or that they shouldn't pursue other options. I was mostly responding to Betty's post, which sounded depressed about her marketing efforts' return. I may have read it wrong.

About there being thousands of submissions for just a few commercial contracts. Yes and no. It's not as lottery-like as that sounds. Most submissions that publishers get are unpublishable, so assigning a number to those submissions is meaningless. They are unpublishable for various reasons, only one of which is quality. Potential market is the deciding factor. You have to show that there is large (or large enough) public interest in the subject, explain why your book fills a market hole, and why you're the one to fill it. Publishers are all about numbers. I won't say they don't care about quality, but it's secondary, in my observation, to sheer numbers potential. I write non-fiction and textbooks myself. Credentials are important,as you noted. But that doesn't necessarily equate to having a "name." I don't have a name, but I did have some credentials that made it plausible for me to write the books I submitted. I didn't have the credentials for other books, and those proposals were turned down.

dt, on the interest letter from Recorded Books! Sounds promising. Again, I didn't mean to imply that one shouldn't pursue other options if a commercial contract is not available, or that self-promoting will never pay off. Just that it's rolling a boulder uphill, so folks who go that route shouldn't feel like they didn't try hard enough if their intended results didn't materialize.

LC,

Thanks for explaining that. We're just a little touchy sometimes. At the same time we are dreaming, we are realistically focused.

Carol

LC, that was over a year ago, the contract was executed and the audio book is in libraries nationwide. Not everyone pursued a commercial contract, I didn't. The commercial contract came to me.

I know that things don't always work out for every author out there, but different people are doing this for different reasons.

It's just something to keep in mind.

dt, again, great to hear. I will have to check it out next time I'm at the library!

cturkel wrote:

Quote :

Who wants to be famous anyway?

Me!

You are infamous --better look behind you Dick Stodghill is after you.

He is no coward--so there!

Alice wrote:

cturkel wrote:

Quote :

Who wants to be famous anyway?

Me!

You are infamous --better look behind you Dick Stodghill is after you.

He is no coward--so there!

Shelagh,

Thanks for keeping cturkel on board--he adds a dimension!

Dick, I know it's a reality. What's bogus is that people think it's acceptable. Since most book lose money (including those published by the names on your list), I think the publishers have a noticeable flaw in their how-to-sell-a-book plan.

Even Coke promotes and everyone is familiar with the product. So, publishers toss books out there with no ads and zero back up promotion and then everyone sees red ink. Well, it's not working, and neither is a blog tour on blogs frequently only by other writers and 20-30 hits a week.

My 1.5 cents.

Malcolm

I have never understood the pox on self-promotion, after all a commercial by any company is by definition self-promotion. I think the issue is large company promotion vs individual. Our culture is skewed to give the stamp of legitimacy to anything corporate vs an individual.

When I was in a Barnes and Noble this week they had a large table with a sign stating "Publisher Remainders 75% off". I imagined one of those tables in each of their 799 stores, wow, what a busines model with that kind of built-in loss. Now if I wasn't one prone to jump on everything new, I would just wait on the remainder table to shop from.

Scattershot marketing model, an unknown author is taking a huge risk relying on that alone.

Well, I don't really want to be famous, but I'd love my books to be famous.

I kind of like anonymity.

DT, do you think there is anything to the fact that authors are sometimes introverts and uncomfortable with self promotion? There was an article somewhere about "the shy author."

Carol

Carol, the writers I have always associated with are about as shy as a Tiger tank. If you are looking for introverts, never attend a get-together of the Private Eye Writers of America or Mystery Writers of America. Socializing and hard drinking are their hallmarks.

Which reminds me, I will not be attending the April Edgar Awards banquet of MWA. Cost of the banquet is $175 per person. Cost of the "reduced" rate at the hotel is $305 a night. You would be there a minimum of three nights in order to attend all the affairs. Cost is not the reason I'm staying home, however.

I believe LC realizes there is a vast difference in selling and promoting fiction as opposed to non-fiction and textbooks. Two entirely different worlds.

Just delurking to say hello to Dick and will you be attending Bouchercon this year? (Long time fan of EQMM and AHMM, apologies for the thread hijack.)

Probably promoting my book to Marine pilots might require some socializing and . . .

I'm giving this whole topic some further thought.

Carol

Carol, I think some authors are introverts when they are writing because it requires a certain amount of isolation. On the other hand the internet is an introvert's biggest friend. Joining message boards, contacting books clubs etc.; can be done from the comfy confines of your home.

Carol Troestler wrote:

Well, I don't really want to be famous, but I'd love my books to be famous.

I kind of like anonymity.

DT, do you think there is anything to the fact that authors are sometimes introverts and uncomfortable with self promotion? There was an article somewhere about "the shy author."

Carol

If your book is famous, you will be also. Please remember the unknown author me--I stll want to see you.
Love ya,

Alice

Of course a book can be famous without the author being famous. That's what Anonymous means. And pseudonyms.

Everybody knows "The Treasure of the Sierra Madre", but nobody knows who B. Traven was. Etc.

Lovesamy - I can't imagine who you are, but we are considering going to Bouchercon as it will be in Indianapolis. At my age it takes a real optimist to be thinking ahead to October, but I do hope we can make it.