Has it been changed?

4/8/2014

                    Hello Just Me..

                                      I always heard we live in the 5th dimension ? 
                     I wonder what the other demensions are called? Also do you
                     believe that a person or an object can accidently slip into
                     the other dimension if it opened ? I wonder, just asking..

                                                 Cheers...Joe... 

Abe F. March wrote:

The Bible's ungodly origins.

Read this: http://www.deism.com/bibleorigins.htm

Good article, Abe.

A bit of synchronicity:  In that SS class, we had been discussing the Council of Nicaea and the Nicene Creed,  The article was right on about that council and its influence on the accepted books of the Bible.

I remember an incident that occurred in the teacher's lounge of the school where I taught most of my career.  One of the teachers made the statement that our Founding Fathers based the Constitution on the Bible.  Another teacher (not me, I promise) rolled her eyes and spit out:  "Our Founding Fathers were Deists!"

Personally, I am not as hard on Cristianity as the author is from what he says in the rest of the article.  For me, the Trinity does a good job of explaining the different aspects of God.  Not all Christians read the Bible as literal fact.  There are many, myself included, who look for the message of the symbols and see much of the Book as metaphor and myth*. I do not think the bulk of the representatives at Nicaea were as mercenary as the article portrays them.  I think many, maybe most, were trying earnestly to sort through a complex body of work to find what was most appropriate.

But it is good to be aware of the realities that go with the institutions.  It helps us to have a more open mind.


*myth in the sense of the stories that explain a culture.  Much of the problems that people have with the term stem from the definition that Campbell pointed out - seeing "mythology" as "other people's religion."

And, just for the record, my "creds" as LC might say, are connected to my being "just a teacher": A BA in English (literature and language arts) with a history minor and teacher certification. Early American and British Literature are generally studied from a historical perspective. History courses are frequently based on a religious perspective, since the religion of a culture or a country was central to its historical development. The growth of Christianity, its Bible, and of the Protestant Reformation are integral parts of those fields of study. As a result, I have lots of recorded hours in those areas of study. They form the basis of my subsequent personal enrichment studies.

joefrank wrote:

4/8/2014

                    Hello Just Me..

                                      I always heard we live in the 5th dimension ? 
                     I wonder what the other demensions are called? Also do you
                     believe that a person or an object can accidently slip into
                     the other dimension if it opened ? I wonder, just asking..

                                                 Cheers...Joe... 

Some say we live in the 3rd dimension - where material space-time reality is the defining factor. The 4th and 5th dimensions, these sources might say, would be higher dimensions that are part of a New Paradigm of reality.  There are many who believe we are in a transition period of moving into those dimensions.  I've read from those sources that there are maybe a total of 12 in all.

One source, to be taken, maybe, with a grain of salt, that can be found on the internet, and which uses ordinary everyday language to exlain the concepts, is Owen Waters.  I personally liked his old website better, but you can find some of that work here.

alice wrote:

Join in the fun---the more, the merrier.

Religion – the last four pages are demonstrating exactly the reasons it is said, “Never discuss politics or religion with friends or relatives.”  There are no right answers, only opinions.  The only one with the right answers is God and he ain’t talking.

The Bible was written by MEN, several men, not God.  It is subject not only to interpretation by us, but was subjected to the interpretation of those who wrote it.  How would that have been any different than several reporters writing about a story today?  You can bet if twelve reporters write about the same event there will be at least nine different interpretations of the facts.

I don’t push my beliefs on other people and do not let others push theirs on me.  I walked away from the priesthood over fifty years ago because I could not believe all the man made rules and beliefs being taught were God’s will.  I also did not feel, in good conscience that I could tell others the man made rules were God’s will.

God gave the world the Ten Commandments…those are HIS rules and man can’t change them for their convenience.

“And I say also unto thee, that thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”  With that exception, all other religions are manmade, started for someone’s vanity or convenience in order to change the rules or just to make money.

I was raised in the era when Sunday was the Sabbath and you had to attend Mass, now it’s okay to go on Saturday night so as to not be inconvenienced on Sunday.  It was a sin to eat meat on Friday, until enough people complained and the rule was changed.  Gambling was a sin but it was okay for the church to have weekly bingo.  Contraception is wrong even when your family has five kids and dad is working two jobs to keep a roof over their heads.

I decided my God doesn’t hide in a church.  He doesn’t ask for my money to support a fancy life style.  He doesn’t change his rules every couple of years because they were unpopular.  I get up every day and thank him for giving me another day on top of the dirt.  We ‘talk’ every day and when necessary I ask for help in making decisions or for his help with someone’s health or welfare.  If I break one of the Commandments, I ask his forgiveness.  

Whether I’m right or wrong is between me and my God and no one else.

Just stating how I feel and what I believe.

Won’t discuss it or debate it.

God Bless

4/8/2014

                          Don..

                                  ........  


                                              Cheers......Joe..... 

Aw, I was hoping for a debate.  Difficult though when I see many of your points in a similar though sometimes different way.  I was a foster child raised in many churches.  It was very clear to me at a young age that they were all seeing something differently that I found simple.  I was baptized so many times and had Lutheran and Catholic catechism plus Baptist Sunday School that I figured whoever sat at the pearly gate would let me in.  I spent time in Catholic, Lutheran, Southern Baptist, Christian Reformed, Presbyterian, Congregational and Unity churches (significant) and then lived among Buddhists and Hindus, Quakers and Mormons.  They all had something their flock wanted.

I see beliefs as personal experience.  There are people in my church who believe God speaks through them, heals through them and more.  They see angels and talk to their spirits and believe in their reincarnation.  I just go to my church because the minister says things that help me live my life better, the people believe in love and kindness instead of sin and judgment, and the dogma is very small and questioning is encouraged.  I've never heard God, but I've had the chills when I felt a presence that might have emanated from somewhere or those times when I felt an instinct driving me beyond what I anticipated.  I've had some pretty profound coincidences.

Go ahead, DK. You can say it: s-y-n-c-h-r-o-n-i-c-i-t-i-e-s.

I think maybe the more diverse our experiences is, the more open we are to the experience of the group experience.

There is a Unity congregation near downtown SA.  One of these weeks I an going to get up the courage to make the drive.

Don God post. I will not make an effort to change what you believe...I will state a few things I do know as fact;
Catholics eating fish on Friday...The fishermen in Italy did not have money to give to the Church...so the Pope made it a rule, "All Catholics eat fish on Friday.

Sunday is not the seventh day...it is Saturday...
As to mans rules...yes. No religion is from God, nor do they teach Gods laws, or his truth.
Even the days of the week are named for Roman Gods.

Sunday is not the seventh day...it is Saturday...
As to mans rules...yes. No religion is from God, nor do they teach Gods laws, or his truth.
Even the days of the week are named for Roman Gods.




My church teaches this.

My church is not right about everything, but neither am I.
 I will stay with it.

I remember being asked why I sent my children to Catholic church and school when I was not Catholic.  I said I preferred that they learn a religious set of beliefs so they had a standard to test other beliefs against.  It gave them a moral compass, regardless of those without morals who were part of the Catholic hierarchy.  I remember making the sign of the cross on an airplane we thought was going to land in the sea but barely made the landing (Philippines).  The entire plane was making the sign of the cross and using their beads.  Maybe it made a difference...''


Interesting, when I taught school in the Bahamas I asked why the schools taught the Christian religion when it was a country of religious freedom. The superintendent said it was best to give all students something to guide their lives than to give them nothing.  I felt vindicated.

4/8/2014

                   Do you believe ? My friend who died in December kept saying for 
                   several weeks his Mother, Father, Sisters were in the room , they
                   were all deceased. Many times over the decades I've heard this and
                   and wonder why are you allowed to see these people just weeks or
                   days before death ? And yet if nothing is wrong with you, you cannot
                   see them, sometimes I wonder if they could be standing right next to
                   you and you would never know ? I also have heard when someone is
                   dying they come to help you to the other side. Isn't it interesting no
                   scientist or anyone else has tried to find out what this is all about ?

                                                         Cheers.Joe..  

Domenic Pappalardo wrote:

Don Stephens wrote:

You guys sure are fun to watch!

Hahahahaha..... it's always the same people. All one has to do is print the word, "Bible," or "God," and the two come alive. One believes they will become part of the universe, and the other can hold conversations with the dead.
Watch the reaction this post gets...LOL.

As for having conversations with the dead, that is crap.  Having a conversation/communication with the departed spirit of the dead is another matter entirely since the energy/spirit lives on.  That is based on the fact that the body is made up of energy and that energy never dies.  When one prays, is that person praying to a person or to a spirit - an eternal energy? Is "The Holy Sprit" a dead body?

Yes, Dom, I believe I am part of the universe and shall remain part of it even when my body ceases to function.

As Don pointed out, discussions about politics and/or religion bring out the best and worst in people.  I don’t know if I am alone with my thoughts, but I often get the feeling that the writer is often trying to send a hidden message to the reader prompting one to “read between the lines”.  Is the intent of the post to inform, disparage, and poke fun or simply a means of transferring one’s own frustration of not having the answers to another?
The post I made about “The Ungodly Origins of the Bible” I had hoped would be read before discussion about the contents.  The questions posed by many who came before us, as stated in the article, are still being asked today.  I admit that I don’t have the answers and still have many questions.  We can read and research a subject, but instead of finding the answers we seek, it often happens that we have more questions.
 
The Bible is a book, written by man.  Everyone on this forum has written at least one book.  Some write fiction, some write non-fiction and some have written both.  The mental process of writing often considers the potential reader.  Why did we write what we wrote?   Was it to inform or does our writing have a political or spiritual message?  Why did those who wrote the Bible write what they wrote?  Delving into the psyche of the writer may help us in accepting or rejection some or all of what is written.  Nothing new in that.  Even when writing for entertainment. We consider the potential reader.  What was the intent of the biblical writers?  None had any firsthand knowledge of what was allegedly said.  How much literary license did they use in recording their second, third, fourth or even more hand knowledge?
 
I find it difficult to accept the Bible as the literal word of God.   Admittedly it is an all-time best seller and has been a guide on how to live.  The God/Spirit within us speaks more loudly than written words.

The Bible is  a very powerful book and has changed many people's lives for the better.
I believe  the Ten Commandments were inspired by God.

alice wrote:

The Bible is  a very powerful book and has changed many people's lives for the better.
I believe  the Ten Commandments were inspired by God.

We get the ten Commandments from the Bible. If you doubt the Bible, how can you believe in the ten Commandments?

God wrote the ten Commandments in stone with his finger. Moses said God did it. How do we know Moses didn't do it? Unless you prove the Bible the word of God, there is nothing in it you can believe.

If you can prove the Bible true, than all the things you can't prove in it, you can trust as true...would you not agree?

Who said I doubted the Bible?

alice wrote:

Who said I doubted the Bible?

I was not suggesting you doubted the Bible, I was just asking, "If you believe in part of it, would you (meaning anybody) not believe in all of it?

Domenic Pappalardo wrote:

alice wrote:

Who said I doubted the Bible?

I was not suggesting you doubted the Bible, I was just asking, "If you believe in part of it, would you (meaning anybody) not believe in all of it?

I believe the Bible is God's holy word.  I have reverence for it  and treat it as a holy book.  I believe all of it was written for our admonition and/ or instruction.

Further:  The Bible is read from in churches, at gravesides and  is quoted  from to comfort the sick,  dying, bereaved or just fearful. 

It has no equal from our writers here.
To me it seems preposterous that unlearned fisherman could write such a thing. 
The way I see it.

alice wrote:

Domenic Pappalardo wrote:

alice wrote:

Who said I doubted the Bible?

I was not suggesting you doubted the Bible, I was just asking, "If you believe in part of it, would you (meaning anybody) not believe in all of it?

I believe the Bible is God's holy word.  I have reverence for it  and treat it as a holy book.  I believe all of it was written for our admonition and/ or instruction.

Further:  The Bible is read from in churches, at gravesides and  is quoted  from to comfort the sick,  dying, bereaved or just fearful. 

It has no equal from our writers here.
To me it seems preposterous that unlearned fisherman could write such a thing. 
The way I see it.

Being writers(sic) we understand unlearned men could not write like they did without Gods hand.

Of course. My belief is that the power and energy we attribute to "God" is in and through all living things (maybe dead ones, too).  Thus, any talent we discover from within is part of the stuff with which we were created.

Prodigies and genius's abound.  Also, remember that the Bible is a collection of works by many writers who recorded passed down stories.  Of course it is a not perfect.

Lack of perfection, however, takes nothing away from its magnificence.  Truly a book that changed the world deserves respect and awe.  I am sure that many of the writers were as inspired by their beliefs as writers today who say they channel the word of God.

There are many writers today who claim the same connection to God's direction.  They have also written quite profound tombs.

4/9/2014

                           God is the higher authority.

                           Cheers..Joe..