Amazon putting the squeeze on POD publishers!!

I don't think that's a very adult way to deal with the situation. Meiners should be taking legal action on behalf of his authors. But then, his behavour doesn't surprise me either.

This is incredible. Thanks for sharing the information.

Kathleen Gage

Well, the word "antitrust" comes to mind.

When I read the news, I called iUniverse; just how much the telephone reps have been told or are authorized to say, I don't know. At present, the BUY buttons are still on for my book and another iUniverse title I checked.

iUniverse may have a different kind of agreement. My impression was that in the past Amazon actually had the files to iUniverse books and had the option of printing them or getting them from outside. Yet, when I order books to sell personally or order them for a bookstore, they always come from Lightning Source.

I'm already looking for other publishing options, though, just to be ready in case iUniverse and Amazon also part ways. Frankly, I don't know why Amazon outsells B&N.com because the operations mostly offer the same kinds of things; B&N also has a membership system that cuts the price on books and sells them lower than the Amazon price. So, we may want to beef up promos aimed at B&N.

Malcolm

This is a press release from Amazon:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Yes, I think iUniverse has a sweetheart deal with amazon and perhaps B&N.


I don't think anti-trust quite applies here. (If MICROSOFT can't get nailed, these guys are sure in the clear)

There might be some sort of restraint of trade thing, but basically they are just exercising their right to sell what they want to. Sears sells Craftsman tools, their own brand of washers...

Doesn't mean it doesn't suck, of course.

The press release, I hate to say it, sounds pretty reasonable.

A pack of self-serving lies, but reasonable. Obviously their motivation in in-housing is not to serve customers better. (Were they getting complaints? Are they offering customers a choice?)

I still think the only way to beat this is a work-around.

If this site, or some press or individual, wants to be a Hero of the Revolution, they should start thinking about setting up a Third Party Sellers Cartel.

B&N and iUniverse are part of the same ownership hierarchy. Sears, of course, sells non-Craftsman products and Whirlpool makes the washers with the Kenmore name on them.

Even so, Amazon I think will dig its own grave with this.

Malcolm

Well not to beat a dead horse or anything [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] but I think Amazon is going to do it/get away with it, however the press release does present a compelling case for them. Anyway, we'll just have to continue to flood the market with all of our good works and then just see if Amazon can keep up. Look out world!

Sears, of course, sells non-Craftsman products and Whirlpool makes the washers with the Kenmore name on them.

Yep. And if amazon wants to see their own stuff they can do it if they want. No law against it.

It sucks, but it's not illegal

Yup! Everyone keep on writing and submitting.

Pam, you tried to buy my book? How sweet of you, but Ten Times Guilty hasn't been available for over a year because I asked for, and received my contract from PA back. I started asking questions on the PAMB about two years ago. The posts were removed, then I was banned. By then I wanted out of my contract.

I used to offer my novel from my websites as a single purchase and also as a special to those who purchased my plotting ebook. In the ebook, I demonstrated on the charts how I plotted TTG, so people who bought the ebook also bought the novel to compare.

I still have a couple of copies left if you'd like. Send an email and I'll let you know.

BTW, the new Amazon rule applies to all POD publishers. Each day more 'BUY' buttons are removed, so writers with Whiskey Creek Press are included. Samhain keeps saying they're not POD so I'm not sure they'll be removed, but everyone else will be.

Interesting, Brenda. I am still sitting back and watching the developments. Although outraged at the outset, I hate to burn my bridges as it were, and I am hoping the whole issue will be resolved one way or another. Then I can decide how to amend my marketing.

Brenda,

I raised the question with PA whether the lack of a buy button next to our books invalidates our contracts which clearly state that our books will be availabel through Amazon. Needless to say Infocenter removed the question and locked me out of the board. I emailed PA - as I feel this is a legitimate concern. So far they've chosen to ignore my question, so now I've asked to rescind my contract. As yet they've not responded.

As an aside, I haven't received any of their emails about this matter, nor have I received the one offering me discount if I buy my own books.

I've just checked to see if my book is still available on the PA website - guess what? It's not. I assume by that they agreed to my request without formally saying so.

I have refrained from saying anything negative about PA. I don't believe in bashing and regardless of how they treated me, I felt that it served no purpose for me bad mouth them.
How things have changed. I considered trying to cancel my contract but instead decided to just write another book and wait until the one with PA expired. Now I'm not sure what the best move is.
If you don't mind Jenny, I will continue to follow what is transpiring with you.
And Brenda, since your book was terminated with PA, did you seek to have it published by anyone else? If not, why not?

I am also interested in seeing how this plays out.

I have been happy with PA but have noticed that their board regulator (whoever that is) is quick to eliminate threads and banish people from the board. Often, in my opinion, the wrong people. But I have found it to be a valuable resource otherwise.

If our contracts with PA are terminated, can our books be published by someone else as it stands, or must we rewrite it?

Abe and Zada, to try to market a book that’s been published by PA is difficult. You can no longer offer first rights, but more reputable POD publishers used to take them. Then last year, I believe, several of the small publishers posted a notice on their submissions page that they will not consider books previously published with PA. I don’t think they do that now, but that’ll give you an idea of the reputation PA has in the industry. I’ve found some POD publishers will consider a previously published PA book, but it’ll go in as a regular submission and will be evaluated just like any other submission.

I think I’ve mentioned before, that when I told my agent about my PA book, she LAUGHED and said, “We won’t mention it to the publishers.”

Right now I’m just holding it, waiting . . . for what, I don’t know yet. Perhaps when I make a legitimate sale for another novel I’ll submit it.

And Jenny, it does sound as if PA is terminating your contract. They don’t usually notify the writer; instead, they delete the listing and some days later, the notice arrives in the mail.

I think PA is trying to pacify everyone by saying they’ll fight the Amazon rule, but they must know masses of people will want their rights released. However, and I’m not sure how to say this without starting a war, beginning writers will most likely stay with PA because no one else will publish their work.

Those who wish, and WORK for a writing career has a chance to better themselves with other publishers.

There was a time that PA would not release a contract unless the writer took legal action. I know some who fought for several years to be released, so this is a good opportunity for some.

You certainly have the option to re-publish becuase you have maintained copyright over your work with PA, although as Abe mentioned it could be more effective to try another book altogether. I am not sure what the answer is, but I think this discussion is certainly helping to determin all the avenues available.
I sometimes get wrapped up into the credibility issue right up to my neck; I wanted people to buy my book from a publisher or on-line store so that somewhere the royalty counter clicked and it was recorded as an actual sale. This is in contrast to my last box or so in my basement which I take with me all over the place. They don't receive the same kind of ... er...respect.
Not that it would ever want me to change my mind about what I do for a living - I love to write. Every once in while, though, I am envious of my sister's path. She works in a vet clinic where she can go cuddle something warm, fuzzy, and alive...

I know what you mean, Pam. I used to think a brain surgeon's career was easier.

And cuddling? It's been so long since I've held anything other than my computer's mouse that I tell my friends I'd need research to write anything romantic.

Abe and Brenda,

This all started with PA removing my question from their forum and locking me out. I had no idea they had already contacted their authors via email informing them of the situation with Amazon. I emailed them my question - they've chosen to ignore that. Today, as I mentioned I find that my book has vanished from their website. I emailed them to ask about that - again no response. Ironically, my name is still "UP IN LIGHTS" over the interview I gave to BBC Radion Sheffield, and my book is still listed on Amazon.co.uk.

When your publisher doesn't have the courtesy to respond to emails and behaves in such a petty minded way by locking you out of their forum, is it any wonder that PA is now getting such a bad reputation.

I will put my hand on my heart and say I signed the contract with PA in good faith. It was only later, like many other people, did I find out how difficult it was to get my book into stores and that PA is really only interested in selling books to authors, hence the large discount offered.

In the past, I've always kept my opinions of PA to myself - never voiced them in any public forum, but my experience over the last few days only goes to prove what some people say is true.

As they say on your side of the pond - watch this space!

Not sure, Sue, but I believe you, as an independent publisher, can pay the fee for listing your book(s) which I believe is currently $75 per month per title.

Don't quote me, tho. You'd need to send an email to Amazon and ask.

Jenny, a lot of writers are and have been in the same situation, including me. When I first talked to PA in 2004, they assured me they were taking steps to get their books into bookstores. Yeah, right. I've since learned not only have they made it more difficult for their writers to get into bookstores, but they've dropped contracts with those who succeeded to get the large bookstores to carry their books.

PA simply wants to sell to their authors. Less paperwork, less bookkeeping. Their small staff simply cannot handle it all.

Sue I think you nearly answered your own question there -- being independent in your case is still self published. However, on the upside folks, the printing press was just the start of bringing the Word to the masses, and that has evolved to where we are today and everyone in school learns to read, we teach our kids to write and people who have something to say have tons of options to share their words through print, the internet, audio -- who knows what will be next?

I have been working with other authors to get their books published whether through my company or something that fits 'them' better. If I had or do have another book other than mine to publish I would. I just haven't had the time or felt comfortable enough with the knowledge I have to do that yet. That is why I don't consider myself self-published. Does that make a difference?

The input to this subject is good. I think we will all be wiser for the experience this is giving us.
I will break a rule and give just one "war story" concerning PA.
The director of the Library in Lebanon wanted to distribute my book throughout the Middle East. He said he would place an order for 600 to 1000 books to start. He wanted to know who he could contact to negotiate a discount and discuss rights for the M.E. It became clear (for the second time) that there is no one with a business head working there. They at first didn't respond to the inquiry. Then they said he could give them his credit card and they would ship to him as with any customer. After numerous emails, etc., I finally wrote a letter to the President of PA., explaining the situation, that an appropriate discount needed to be negotiated, and arrangements for shipping. Perhaps it could be shipped from the UK, etc. Two weeks later I got an email from PA's Author Support informing me that the President doesn't accept letters from authors and that I would have to deal with them. By the time I finishing ranting and raving and got them to respond to the director, he was no longer interested. He said that he couldn't deal with a company that was so "unprofessional" and didn't understand business. That cost me money and the potential for much more.