Worst-Case Scenario

For a "worst case scenario" where you need to live off the land indefinitely, I'd recommend the SAS Survival Guide:

http://www.amazon.com/Sas-Survival-Guide-Survive-Anywhere/dp/0007183305/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1237536294&sr=1-2

I've kept one in my rucksack for a number of years, and I use it in the summer when I go up into the hills to see what life could be like if civilization suddenly disappeared.

I have also toyed with using portable energy devices so that music and entertainment should not cease when you're out in the wilderness:

http://uk.geocities.com/aa_spaceagent/restricted/portable-energy.html

I have a Red Cross book on how to survive during and after a number of catastrophes from earthquakes to civil unrest.

The course I want to take with the Red Cross is "humanitarian law." That fascinates me. I know you probably don't think that would apply, but it is something many believe is right, and perhaps in complete unrest of the world, that might be all that was left, and principles that begin a new world better than the last.

Just some thoughts.

Carol

Ahad, there are several households out here that use the solar panels. One lady I know uses them and batteries exclusively (she has wood and gas heat) and lives quite well with them, even in this climate! And she has no electric bill. Others use them for hot water, and for things like tv and other entertainment. But the ones they have are much more expensive than what you quote on the AA Institute site.

Zada, mines were only a "toy" sized solar panel endeavor...a play thing... to power something as small as a Sony walkman or a radio controlled buggy, such as this:

http://www.astroscience.org/abdul-ahad/phase2vehicle2.JPG

But in principle these things actually work. I do not buy AA sized batteries anymore since the solar panels work well in the long sunny days in summer. The 12-volt lead/acid battery I use on my telescope drive is charged using these same panels also.

All fun things to do!

There are some apartment buildings and homes around Seattle that are 'greening' their roofs. Not just rooftop gardens, but actually turning their entire roof into a garden. It insulates and gives them extra planting space while helping the environment!

That survival book link you posted is a good one. Much more reasonably priced than I would have thought.

The gun shows usually have 2 or 3 vendors with survival handbooks. They even have medical emergency guides.

A grand idea to convert one's roof space (what we call a "loft") into gardening space and grow stuff there.

Then there are those who also do crooked stuff like grow weed, marijuana and cannabis there!

http://www.cannabis-pics.com/1412loft2-med.jpg

Phil, sounds interesting. Also interesting is this idea that has permeated the minds of those of us in the western world for the last 16 centuries, and that is the spectre of a total collapse of society that looms just above our heads like the sword of Damascales. I like reading this kind of stuff!

I do find it interesting though, just how much this mental image remains in our collective imaginations, for it is really just the shadows of the Dark Ages and the collapse of Rome that is in our collective memories. So shattering and devastating was the collapse of Roman law and order that it is still remembered by us to this very day.

But, I wonder if it was really like that? Did the Dark Ages come upon the western world all at once, or was it gradual and creeping, like a hand that slowly strangled civilization to death in the 400s AD?

The answer is both, as most of the population back then only really felt what was happening in thier villiage. News of things like the sack of Rome in 410 AD migth have reached them, but everyone felt that the Empire would recover and things would eventually get better. It was only when the Visigoths or Saxons showed up and burned thier villiage and carried thier children off to slavery that it dawned on the people that things were not going to recover. Then the real terror set it, and this terror was so profound that it remains in our collective consciousness to this very day.

It is also interesting that in popular fiction, such as "The Road Warrior" and so on, that society does eventually begin to rebuild. Thus the collapse scenario is kept to some kind of timeframe. This enables the survivalist among us to see the wisdom of stockpiling things that will keep us going until the Empire (Civilization) recovers.

But what would we think about a scenario in which there will be no recovery for a thousand years, and warlords and brutality shall reighn in the mean time? Then we have a different type of thing to contemplate. How does one stockpile for that?

Well, that is terrifying indeed, and it was something like this thought that finally crept into the minds of our ancestors in Europe, and especially Britain. Perhaps that is why these things are still in our collective consciousness to this very time? Perhaps we can sense, as the 4th century Romans did, that it is just time for a collapse?

Perhaps these upheavals are a natural side effect of civilization? Now, even the earth is seemingly willing to rebel against us with global warming and pollution that would threaten even our environment. Or, perhaps this notion of environmental collapse is just an advanced level of thinking towards how we see ourselves as the masters of our civilized planet?

I think that the best thing that a person could do to prepare for a collapse would be to learn a useful skill that the warlords and barbarians to come would desire. As for me, I think that I will take up knitting and the production of chain maille armor. Surely in a "Roadwarrior" scenario, someone who could provide warm socks and a shirt of chain maille would be someone who they would want to keep around?

After all, the learnign of these family trades was instrumental in helping us to gain surnames, like Miller, Farmer, Wainwright, etc. I may learn the art of building castles, as my Saxon surname suggest. Stan-(stone) and Bery-(boro) which means fort.

I think that when we look out and see the dragon ships plying the waters of the Missisippi, coming to bring devastation upon our homes, then we will know that the gig is up.

Interesting post this. Keep up the good work, Phil. I think that you are on to something.

Not exactly on topic, but Marie's mention of firing the shotgun reminded me of this.

________________________________

From "The Last of the South Town Rinky Dinks" E. Don Harpe



Holidays were special for the Rinky Dinks in more ways than one. A holiday always meant a lot of food, usually some kind of ball game, and some of the holidays involved fireworks. Granted, they weren't the huge, spectacular fireworks displays we are accustomed to now, but all of us liked them just the same. The Fourth of July was always celebrated with firecrackers, and Christmas meant sparklers and Roman candles. Daddy used to buy a few small pinwheels that he would stick up on a fence post in the back of the yard and light. We loved to see the sparks as the little wheels spun, and I can still close my eyes and bring those moments back.

But there other occasions when fireworks weren't all that made noise.

Most of the men on the street would take their shotguns into the back yard and shoot several rounds along about sunset on fireworks days.

I remember Daddy trying to get me to shoot his 12 gauge double barrel shotgun one fourth of July. I wasn't very old, and I wasn't very big, and I didn't much want to fire the big gun, because I knew how hard it kicked. It hurt your shoulder every time you shot it, and I wasn't really wanting to do it, but Daddy insisted. He shouldn't have. Mama heard me saying I didn't want to shoot it and came out in the back yard to see what was going on.

Birtle, what are you trying to get Donald to do?

I just want him to shoot the shotgun, that's all.

But he don't want to shoot the gun.

Well, it won't hurt him none.

Maybe not, that's not the point. Ain't you always taught him not to shoot the gun unless he was shootin' at some kind of meat?

Yeah, but this is the Fourth of July, and I just wanted to let him shoot it once or twice, and I don't know why he don't want to.

Well, if you want him to shoot it so bad, why don't you take off running down across the field, and I'll see if I can talk him it taking a shot or two at you with it.

Now, Lena, I wanted him to shoot it up in the air.

Well, then climb up on the coalhouse, and he can shoot at you up there.

That was the end of that discussion.
A few years later, once I got a little weight on my skinny little frame, I fired the shotgun every now and then. And it did kick. Not bad enough to hurt for a long time, but enough that you knew you had been shooting it.

Back to the solar ideas and being creative. There is a poverty war torn country in Africa where the government forbid the use of wood or charcoal the people used for cooking. So an organization is sending them solar panels for this.

Richard, I love your posts.

I have found a line of my family that goes way, way back to the third century. Someone did a lot of work on that line. I think you could be right, about these ideas being part of our inner workings from times gone by.

I was not alive during the depression, but for years I saved clothing, canned goods, etc., in case there was another depression or war or whatever.

Carol

Just doing some editing of my posts here.

Carol

Great post, Richard! I was particularly struck with the part where you said:

Quote :

This enables the survivalist among us to see the
wisdom of stockpiling things that will keep us going until the Empire
(Civilization) recovers.

Last night I was lying in my bed thinking about what I would take with
me if I had to bug out on foot. With all the stockpiling (very little)
I have done, and now I have to choose what I can carry on my back.

So I have 10 gallons of water - I may could manage 2 canteens.

I have a lot of canned goods - too much to carry.

I have many firearms - I could carry maybe one rifle and one revolver (and ammo)

Food items need to be dried and packed small - like Daisy Seal-a-Meal bags.

You get the drift... I think it would be best to remain in place until
everything that can't be carried is used up, and all the perishables
cooked, dried and packed. Don't leave anything for the looters. They're
not going to be interested in TV's, computers or any large items
anyway. They want food, drugs, guns - same as you.

When you do "bug out", it may be a good time to think about trade goods. What will become the new currency?

Think addictions - coffee, tobacco and liquor. Those small freeze-dried
bags of coffee, a couple cartons of Marlboros, and as many half-pint
bottles of whiskey as you can manage will get you food and most
anything else you need.

And Zada, I think I have just remembered that word I was looking for - a BUG-OUT bag!

Good posts, everybody!

Richard wrote:

Quote :

The answer is both, as most of the population back then only really felt what was happening in thier villiage. News of things like the sack of Rome in 410 AD migth have reached them, but everyone felt that the Empire would recover and things would eventually get better. It was only when the Visigoths or Saxons showed up and burned thier villiage and carried thier children off to slavery that it dawned on the people that things were not going to recover. Then the real terror set it, and this terror was so profound that it remains in our collective consciousness to this very day.

Very good point, Richard

Ann

I got this today from the Red Cross. I think it applies here.

"Check out a few of the classes ... such as Mass Casualty Disaster, Weapons of Mass Destruction/Terrorism, . .

Would you like to empower others to be prepared in case of a disaster? Then sign up to take the Community Disaster Educator’s Workshop! You will learn a lot about how to be prepared when disaster strikes and how to teach others to prepare as well.

Please note the change of date for the Humanity in the Midst of War class."

And believe me, I've taken some of these courses and they don't mince words. You hear it all. Note they said, "when disaster strikes" not "if."

Carol

Carol, the last 15 years of my hospital career I sat (and chaired) the
Safety Committee. I wrote the disaster scenarios for the Disaster Prep
group. The last one I wrote was for an internal disaster - one that
affected the hospital proper. Since I gave classes in Electrical and
Fire Safety, I presented this to the committee:

"Remember that for a fire to exist, there must be three things present; fuel, oxygen and a source of ignition."

I then turned on the projector to show the short video I had prepared.
It was a scene from the rear of the hospital near the loading dock. It
opens with a shot of the above-ground, 10,000 gallon diesel tank, slow
pan to the right on the huge liquid O2 tank, and then on to the main
electrical transformers - all within 30 feet of each other!

The silence in the room was deafening.

My scenario had a tanker truck backing into the tanks and rupturing them. (there were no barriers at that time).

I asked the Fire Marshall to review the scenario for validity. He was
also stunned, but said, "You see those apartment buildings over there?"
pointing where they were, about a quarter-mile away. "That would be
about where we would set up our command post. This whole area would be
a smoking hole."

Marie,

Check out:

http://www.avhub.net/congressionalhideawaygreenbriar.htm

Carol

I really like the story so far, Marie. I almost wish I hadn't read it -
it's going to be difficult to not let some of your concept slither into
what we're writing... LOL

Brew, you have an email.

Marie, we're not really going to be all that close to your concept. We are going to kill of the head of the government, but much quicker than you did.

Here is a late Christmas gift. Just click on the link to see something that is quite funny, and it might apply to this thread of disasters and doomsdays! Have fun!...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWp1F3goHxA

You guys had me thinking about perishables. A good dehydrator works wonders and removes most of the weight! Then vacuum seal, and you are ready to go. But you need to have this stuff on hand before you bug-out!! I have friends who are survivalists, and they have stores of dried foods. All in vacuum sealed bags.

It is also good to have a herbalist's reference book, to make your own remedies, poultices and the like.

But, then, how many folks think that far ahead?

Zada, we have a dehydrator and a Daisy Seal-a-Meal. Those things are
great. We make a lot of jerky, both beef and venison. Never tried
pork... is that possible - or dangerous?

We even dry tomatoes and then powder them for adding to soups and stews.

Brew, if you do onions that way, it is the same as Lipton's onion soup (Minus the spices, of course) and it tastes great.

This one is for Phil...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4s0nzsU1Wg

Richard, it may have been for Phil, but I really enjoyed it!

Wow this is a great thread - I feel like I have missed a kajillion or so posts though!

Zada you are right in that people don't think ahead. At all. Here, we are told to have 3 days of supplies on hand in case of a storm, but often the power can be out for a week in the rural areas, so you're already hungry. That and our just in time delivery means that there is only about 3 days worth of produce, and maybe a week's worth of dry goods in the province. And in case you are wondering, we're connected to the rest of the country by this one highway, that is absolutely treacherous (and closes) in the winter. What the hell was I thinking in moving out here?? Now I need a dehydrator, and big storage area, a lot of ammo...it does sound like the makings of a great book Brew - look at the conversation you have started!