Does self-pub hurt/help publication chances? Think again.

Shelagh wrote:

You could probably double your income by working the same number of hours working outside of the home. You said it's a matter of choice; you prefer to stay at home.

? I have a full-time job. I don't want a SECOND job for additional income; I can generate it more productively writing books.

Quote :

Why can you not allow people to write the stories they want to write, to not attend conferences or join writers' groups. Instead, their rejected manuscripts can be self-published by choice. Even if they could make far more money by stacking shelves in a supermarket.

?? again. People can do whatever they want! Right now on WN someone is defending her decision to use Tate. Others are jumping on her, and I'm just laughing. Go throw that $4K in a hole, who cares? I simply challenged the assertion in the OP here.

lin wrote:

The nerve of dragging one's own books into this. It's much more tasteful to show pictures of alleged paychecks.

I've seen your website ...I don't think you're the person to lecture on taste...

No, you challenged what you PROJECTED as the assertion. Read it again. Have a grownup read it to you and explain it.

Tell me what the "assertion" was that you are challenging? You're just trying to quarrel. Which is what kind of pushes you over from sad to obnoxious. You aren't even winning anything or having any fun. Just being a snag, yapping at heels of bigger, smarter beings.

Fair enough. Let's see your website.

Well not really "fair" actually. You could have seen ANYTHING and said the same thing. But come on, let's see the site you use to sell your work.

Like I said, no point, no win...just being nasty for its own sake

Horticulture

I don't have a site to sell my work. I don't have to. Rod and gun, Cengage and Prentice Hall do that for me. :: snag:::

What's that asssertion, again, honey? That you've been refuting?

You don't NEED me. You don't really need people to yap at. You can make up things to argue with yourself about (obviously) without having to get other people involved.

LC wrote:

Shelagh wrote:

You could probably double your income by working the same number of hours working outside of the home. You said it's a matter of choice; you prefer to stay at home.

? I have a full-time job. I don't want a SECOND job for additional income; I can generate it more productively writing books.

Clearly, you cannot afford to give up your full-time job to work as a full-time writer. This is something I find very odd about writers who can't make a living through their writing yet advocate that writing should be taken seriously and authors should only publish through commercial publishers. What the heck does it matter? If I can afford a higher standard of living than you can, why should I deny myself the pleasure of seeing my books published? Why should I do the same as you and end up less well-off?

That's a really old-school train of thought, Shelagh, that women who work can't "afford" to stay home. What makes you think I want to stay home? Or be a full-time writer?

And I never said authors should "only" publish through commercial venues. I obviously think it's the best.

Lin -never mind.

Great, you come into a thread I start and turn into a little circus of self-recrimination over nothing, then when asked to state the "assertion" you started this whole little feces-smearing party over, say "never mind".

Horticulture Classic example.

1/1/2010

Thank God the fight is over !
Now let's all be good kids and
make up, we all know where we
stand, but , one must behave them
selves and not throw words or feel
one is better than someone else.
Now all shake hands and behave...
It's funny how writers and artist have
very bad tempers..

Cheers..Joe..

Cheers...Joe

Lin, I still like your idea of using real data. However, for argument's sake there is the old 80/20 rule. In publishing, it's probably 95/5; but if so, 95% of the profits will be made by 5% of the sellers, regardless of where they originate. Unless you are in that top 5%, it's a struggle to the top; and that applies to any career or profession. The percentages may bump up or down, but there's always a few at the top.

My friends used to encourage me to sell Amway. Some people make it to the top in Amway, Avon, Mary Kay, Fuller Brush and Tupperware. The rest struggle. However, it is the knowledge that some make it to the top that keeps the struggle worthwhile. For some, the benefits of a home business or part-time hours make it worthwhile without the struggle to the top. For some, the hype and the camaraderie make it an enjoyable profession.

For income tax purposes, my writing needs to be considered by the IRS as a business, an opportunity to grow my income. Otherwise, it's a hobby. So far, I'm in the business of writing. That's a fact. That's something I can file my taxes on.

I'm also an administrator/educator with strong credentials. I'm pleased that I know teachers who are creating their own curricula with smart boards and smart phones. The world is changing. I don't know where it's going, but I'm sure fascinated by the rapid technological challenges.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, supermarket cashiers earned a median income of $7.90 per hour in 2004;
Read more: Supermarket
Worker Job Description, Career as a Supermarket Worker, Salary,
Employment - Definition and Nature of the Work, Education and Training
Requirements, Getting the Job

A cashier who works two hours a day, seven days per week, picks up $110.60. In six months, that amounts to $2,875.60.

Anyone reading this thread, who picks up less than $2,875.60 in royalties, should seriously consider if writing is going to be a reasonable way to earn an additional income. There are easier and more profitable ways to earn money.

Well, not exactly. Taxes will take about 30% off the top. Then you have gas and wear and tear on the car, misc. work expenses, a uniform purchase or other work clothing, maybe daycare...

Yeah, but it's too late for me now.

Two writers are in a bar. One says, "What would you do if you won the lottery?"
The other one says, "Guess I'd just keep on being a writer until the money ran out."

1/1/2010

Shelagh..

I'm retired right now, so writing has
become more of a passion to me and I will
continue to write murder mysteries. And I have
read so many books from other authors and some
great ones from PA authors, I always believed
everyone has a story to tell, my aim is to get people
especially young ones to read and open their minds.

Cheers..Joe

Jesus Christ.
Don't tell that kid the earth revolves around the sun. She'll start an argument about it.

I'm outta here. If I wanted some nitwit woman following me around trying to pick a fight with everything I said, then changing the subect, I'd get married.

LC wrote:

dtpollard wrote:

Publishers sell what readers will buy. If a celebrity is compelling and has a large following they will pursue that person for a book to be written by someone else because it will sell a certain number of units.

Then their book is not garbage. By definition, garbage is something nobody wants.

No, that is your definition. Classical music does not sell as well as rap music, is it garbage? Pet Rocks sold like crazy, were they masterpieces. Given your logic Big Macs, twinkies and sugar laden drinks are the best things around because kids like them more than vegetables, which I assume in your world is garbage. Just because something sells in large quantity does not make it better than something that sell in a lower volume garbage. If that was the measure of quality then drugs and sex are golden and abstinence is garbage by your standards.

1/1/2010

Lin..

I agree with you, if I won 6 Million dollars
I would still write but there would be one big
difference I would have a secretary...

Cheers..Joe

Quote :

If that was the measure of quality then drugs and sex are golden and abstinence is garbage by your standards.

Well, it always worked for me.

DT -garbage meaning it won't sell at all. Not that it won't sell in relatively smaller quantities. Music companies sell enough classical music to make a profit. When that stops, they'll stop selling it. At that point it will indeed be garbage.

Big Macs, Twinkies and sugar laden drinks are GOLDEN for the companies that make them. Not garbage at all.

I'm using garbage in the context of what will sell. If you can't sell it and can barely give it away, it's garbage. Boo, boop, de boop!

No, LC, that logic is clearly illogical. Everything has an intrinsic value. The stuff you buy from secondhand shops could be called garbage; you think of it as a bargain.

All these classical works can be downloaded free. That does not make them garbage:

http://www.planetebook.com/

LC wrote:

DT -garbage meaning it won't sell at all. Not that it won't sell in relatively smaller quantities. Music companies sell enough classical music to make a profit. When that stops, they'll stop selling it. At that point it will indeed be garbage.

Big Macs, Twinkies and sugar laden drinks are GOLDEN for the companies that make them. Not garbage at all.

I'm using garbage in the context of what will sell. If you can't sell it and can barely give it away, it's garbage. Boo, boop, de boop!

Boo, boop, de boop!
What is this, the third grade? I see a lot of garbage that is selling well and decided not to flush what I believe and write what is the hot genre of the moment. I define garbage as low road material designed to exploit a market without adding much cultural value and in some cases doing damage. That is in the eyes of the readers of course.

Lin, hang in. This is a philosophical discussion for some and your input keeps it interesting, especially the little lottery story - I loved that and will remember it.

I liked that too!

Shelagh -if you can't sell or give something away, it's garbage! Thrift shop clothes that don't sell get donated to Goodwill and eventually on to to rag vendors, who ship them by the truckload to Mexico. Almost garbage!

DT- I have a Betty Boop ornament who's been saying that all day, as the tree gets plugged and unplugged. Sorry, it's in my head. BOO BOOP DE BOOP lol