Death

I want to open a discussion on writing, dreams, control and change. I will not pretent that this thread is not in response to another that has an opposite title. My view is that writing has to be at an acceptable level in combination with compelling material. Secondly the governer to who becomes traditionally published is not a dearth of good material, but a capacity and sales issue within the traditional book market. Publishers are not in a risk taking posture. A sure seller from a politician, celebrity or currently contracted author is where the new releases are coming from.

Part of the discomfort being felt in the traditional publishing business(including authors) is due to the fact that the internet and new publishing technology has allowed market access to writers that bypasses their traditional filters. The floodgates are open. Is everything that comes online a masterpiece, no. Is everything that comes from the hallowed halls of traditional publishing a masterpiece, no. As I posted in an earlier thread, 2008 was the first year that more new titles were produced via print-on-demand instead of the traditional method. Part of that POD volume was from traditional publishing houses.

I once shunned ebook publishing, but as time moved on I realized that my audience was an online entity and accustomed to online purchasing and downloading content. I now view my work as pure content with various output format options thta range from kindle, pdf, audio and paper. Every Kindle book sale I make earns much more than a sale of the same title in paper format. I suggest that everyone take a page from the state of newspapers vs. large online blogs.

Do I consider myself a writter? Yes. I don't make my living writing, but I am published in both the traditional and nontraditional manner. One work is published both ways and is the exact same book. I think that the majority of people here are writers with a dream/desire to be traditionally published and some of the work should be published now. With a shrinking opening for new authors and releases, some have decided to go another route and put their work into the market and allow the reading public to decide. I know all of these books will not end up on the selves of the local bookstore, grocery store and discount store, but, there is still a vast marketplace to pursue.

In the pursuit of literary perfection and traditional publishing acceptance, should aspiring author allow their dreams to die a slow death. A tidal wave of change is racing towards the publishing business. Just like music the landscape will change dramatically over the next 10 years.

I watched the same type of dispute kill another board. I don't think anyone can determine that there is one absolute right way to get things done in today's world given the circumstances.

Good post DT. Thanks for this side of the issue. Both are important.

In the past I would have only believed in the tried and true as Lane pointed out well in the opposite thread.

But this is a new time, with changes. Who will organize those changes is the question. Will it be publishers, authors, the marketplace?

Oh, to write a masterpiece! Few accomplish that, but there is some great writing out there published and not.

Carol

No one can deny that publishing is in a state of flux so it is impossible to disagree with what you have written, DT. I have no idea what the next ten years will bring and have no expectations of being around to find out. The business of writing has always been one that keeps changing, although not as drastically as now. All a writer can do is go with the flow just as you decided e-publications are not all bad.

I do not know why everyone gets go hot about this subject. Everyone here has a different reason for being on this forum. Some think they know a lot, some like me obviously know very little about publishing. I do not think our forte is publishing, but writing. Not all of us have to be worthy of stardom in the writing field to consider ourselves writers, and authors can be people who just have a good time putting words in a row on paper that express their ideas. Poetry comes to my mind. Ramble it out, do it in cadence, keep it in your own mind or let it go out to the world? It is more fun to let it out. Do words have to be worthy of imortality when they are put to paper?

Perhaps that is what holds the human race back from writing things down. The idea that they should be perfect in spelling or grammar.

Writing is an expression of ideas. Not everyone has to think you express your ideas well, but to be able to express your idea so someone else understands your mind is something wonderful. That is why we went to school and learned to read and write, to express ourself. Expression is often not grammatically correct, but the idea understood.

Many on this board know what I am talking about. Words are the tools. But the brain and inovation is the mechanic.

Love,
Betty

Well said, Betty.

Betty,

Nicely said.

Good topic, DT. Thank you for putting your thoughts here. It seems you always have something wise to add.

Betty has a rare talent for cutting though the blather and hype to get to what is really importasnt. I don't believe she realizes what a wonderful way she has with words. No school or mentor can teach it; it comes from the heart.

Very good post DT. For me writing is getting it all out onto the computer or onto a piece of paper. It was never my intention to become a published author it just happened.

Being it a masterpiece is not at all predecided....

Going out with a bang or with a major fanbase aka celebrity writer is something some people strive for...but that rarely happens like it has already been pointed out.

I believe firmly that when we puit our words on the computer or paper they are then, at that time immortal. We might die with the crude matter in that in which we live in, but our words whether be written or spoken are truely immortal.

If we discussed everything you touched on in your opening post, this would be a very long and interesting thread.

So, I'll just focus on two aspects of it. So far, most of those who read novels are people who grew up with the traditional model. We like reading a hard copy book in bed, in a comfortable chair in the living room, on planes...

E-books don't lend themselves to this. But as devices like Kindle become more popular (and cheaper) there may well a shift in the audience. Electronic reading will probably increase since new readers will be more attuned to it.

The second thing that comes to mind is the increase in self-published books. I like the democracy of it and I like being able to publish things the establishment won't take a risk on--or doesn't like.

But the downside is that in most cases, most people will not read a self-published novel in any format because they read authors they hear about or who are famous or who are being aggressively marketed via traditional publishing companies. We live in a media culture: people follow the crowds and follow the buzz and the fads.

It is very difficult for an unknown author to use money from his family budget to compete with what HarperCollins can do. There are a lot of online techniques--Internet radio, blog tours, blog interviews--that authors can purchase to promote their books. So far, I believe that for most fiction writers, the cost of these promotional methods will far exceed the sales income from the books sold as a result.

My novel "The Sun Singer" has received good reviews from most of those who have read it, especially when the readers know the book is literary fiction and not commercial fiction (and select it for that reason). Big difference!

In spite of this, during the five years since it was published, I'm guessing that a very liberal estimate of the number of people who've read the book is 500. My dream, of course, was that it would catch on, perhaps even be found by a mainstream publisher with a PR staff who could promote it in ways I cannot. As time went by, I spent money with various advertising and promotion schemes, and most of them made absolutely no difference whatsoever in the book's sales figures at the time.

While I'm happy the book is "out there," if I had it to do over again I would have kept waiting for a traditional publisher. As an author, I am not writing because it's a hobby or a dream (even though it's all of that) but because it's a profession. It's supposed to provide income, not an endless list of bills.

I certainly salute the spunk and grit of everyone who goes out and finds a printer and rolls their own books--or those who go out to iUniverse and Lulu. These are fields of dreams and they are good ones. So far, the whole process--especially for fiction--has not yet shown itself to be a very viable money-making career. Those providing the promotional deals are making the money, not the authors.

I hope this will be change, but I don't see how. The tools and the arena that make it possible for large numbers of people to write books are the very same tools and arena that are keeping those books from being sold in appreciable numbers. Malcolm Campbell in Jackson County, Georgia will never compete with Nora Roberts and the Internet is making the gulf between us wider rather than narrower.

Malcolm

A fine summation, Malcolm.
Even being published by one of the top houses is no guarantee of success. I mentioned elsewhere a recent visit to Borders. The number of books in a large mystery section was overwhelming. I never heard of many of the writers. I did spend time looking at the books of writers I know or have either heard of or read. Had I been buying, those are the books I would have bought. It's the same when I visit a library. I may be a poor judge, though, because I much prefer reading short stories. A few writers can keep me interested in finishing a novel, but very few.

Like anything else, Dick, we tend to go with a "known product." So, we're likely to read somebody we know about and then possibly to experiment with something different after seeing a review or hearing a suggestion from a close friend.

Malcolm

Malcolm,
I feel the analysis you made makes sense. Writing is a chore. To me, writing expecting no return, doesn't make much sense. For some, the return they expect is not always money. I can see that with one novel, but to continue writing there should be some compensation for the effort.

Malcolm wrote:

As an author, I am not writing because it's a hobby or a dream (even though it's all of that) but because it's a profession. It's supposed to provide income, not an endless list of bills.

I certainly salute the spunk and grit of everyone who goes out and finds a printer and rolls their own books--or those who go out to iUniverse and Lulu. These are fields of dreams and they are good ones. So far, the whole process--especially for fiction--has not yet shown itself to be a very viable money-making career. Those providing the promotional deals are making the money, not the authors.

Malcolm, I totally agree. I started writing in an era when a writer was published by a mainstream publisher or went with one of the few vanity presses available, and at that time, no one I knew wanted to go that route. We all attended classes, quite a few of them, attended conferences, and learned everything we could about the craft of writing.

Today, I'm still not with the majors, but that's my goal. Writing is not a hobby; I make my living by writing and editing, altho I've cut way back on editing and my novel writing workshops to devote more time to my current wip.

Dick says that being published by mainstream is no guarantee of success, but the writers I personally know who are signed with the biggies make a good living. Not only from the advances, but from royalties as well. They're accepted by the chain bookstores who happily accomodate signings by ordering in the books. How many small presses do that? Very few, I've discovered, so that's another expense that's not a worry. Workshops and speaking engagements also contribute to a writer's income. But how successful are speaking engagements for writers signed with small presses or self-pubs? They simply do not have the clout or drawing power of a writer with a major publisher.

But on this board as well as in life, we have a group of writers who want various things. Not all of us are driven as I am, and that's fine.

And while I occasionally enjoy reading a short piece online, I want the comfort of a physical book when I relax - on the sofa, in bed, or even soaking in the tub.

Abe: Yes, it's hard work, and it's solitary work unless you're a busy reporter writing for a news outlet. If people see their writing as a hobby and don't mind that their books only sell a few copies, that's fine with me. Likewise, while it's fun to dream, it seems a little off the mark to believe on has to be the next Jo Rowling or nothing. It would be nice, though, to sell a credible number of books so that there is a reasonable income there.

Brenda: I grew up under similar circumstances. In those days, the people who went to a vanity press ended up with many crates of books in their garage. Now, POD at least keeps that from happening. I know that some non-fiction authors who write self-help and other hot-issue books can sell their self-published books off their own web sites and make a ton of money. Fiction is different. As for me, I don't want a lifestyle where speeches, tie-ins, courses and other collateral stuff take me away from writing so that my output suffers because I'm doing "too well" with online "how to write" podcasts.

Malcolm

Like you, I don't want my writing time to suffer because of other engagements, but I would like to travel and offer workshops in different cities. An author can only do that if they're well-known.

I'm presenting a workshop at the WoW conference in Las Vegas this year, but I'm not sure of the number of people attending since WoW isn't nearly as well-known as, say, the RWA conference which draws writers and readers from all over the world. So it may or may not be worth my time. But when a writer has clout, well, as they say, 'time is money.'

And dreams of making it big? Of course. If we have that desire, keep dreaming because it can happen, and I don't care who doubts it. I've personally seen it happen time and again. The only time a writer can be sure it won't happen is when that writer gives up.

What I am referring to, Brenda, is the steady stream of one-book-wonders in the field I know best, mysteries. Only a small percentage of the writers in MWA or PWA make it on their writing alone, but a few are wealthy as a result of writing. A great many "full-time" writers have a spouse that works and provides a steady income. A number of others are lawyers, doctors, priests, professors, librarians and just about any other occupation you can name as well as being "full-time" writers. Bill Pronzini and his wife Marcia Muller each write their own books so as a couple do well financially but are not wealthy. A friend who had about 20 books published by one of the giants recently saw them drop his entire backlist so to keep the books in print he shipped them to a regional puiblisher.
For the top 15 or 20 writers in the field, life continues much as it was. Many others are forced to switch publishers after every book (using pseudonyms that fool no one but appear to present a fresh face). Another whose publisher was Charles Scribner's Sons had to use PublishAmerica to get his latest book in print. A Grand Master of MWA wrote me to say that "some bubbles are bursting."
The one thing I hear most often is complaints over the sharp decrease in advances and the severe cutback in promotion except for those who write the blockbusters. In the steady stream of interviews with leading agents and publishers in MWA publications one question has become commonplace: "How do you plan to promote your next book?"
A number of conventions and workshops have been cancelled owing to a lack of participants thanks to economic conditions.
It has always been a tough business and it has grown even rougher in recent years. Many writers are finding that getting the second book published is even harder than finding someone willing to publish the first. Yet through it all the Bob Parkers, Mary Higgins Clarks, Sue Graftons, Larry Blocks, Stephen Kings, John Grishams and some others are raking in big bucks. Joining them at or near the top is a difficult climb. A few make it, most fall by the wayside. For those who write novels, hoping to be one of those few makes it all worthwhile.

There is a self-published book that at the time of this message was sitting at #137 on amazon.com, just outside of the top 100. This book is about Michael jackson and was published in 2007 by iUniverse. Why it is with iUniverse, I don't know. What I do know is if it was not available, the opportunity, as unfortunate as it was, would have been missed. Statements about it not being in stores etc. are not relevant, maybe a major publisher didn't bite or maybe the author didn't want to wait.

link to amazon

You never know what can happen. Every author has their own motivations. I got one publishing deal by gaining attention with my second book. I know of authors that have been dropped after two or three books. On the other hand Nora Roberts was on the front page rotation of AOL.com for her new book. Very few get that kind of push.