Life

Life is too short to engage in endless discussions about the fictional efficacy of mediocrity

I agree about the back slapping, Lane. However, publishers will not discourage writers, no matter how bad they are. Most of the members here seek advice and then move on. Those who stay enjoy the rapport with fellow writers.

Serious writers seem to be threatened by the online presence of thousands of "mediocre" writers. I can't for the life of me understand why. I run the Published Authors Network on ning.com and a similar group on linkedin.com.

Both groups have over 800 members (the Ning group has close to a thousand). The Ning group is made up of mainly small press and self-published authors. The LinkedIn group is a mixture of professional writers and self-published authors.

A thread I started on LinkedIn about how a self-published author acquired a contract with Warner Books is the longest thread on the group forum.

Long threads survive because of heated debate and disagreement -- and there was plenty of that! The "professional" writers started calling the group the "Self-published Authors Network" and claimed that the group only represented the self-published. So, I set up a self-published subgroup and invited all the members to join. To date, there are only twenty-seven members.

On the long thread, the self-published members were accused of tainting the group and treated to a barrage of put-downs by the "traditionally" published authors. The truth is that, for some unknown reason, the "writers" felt threatened by the self-published authors.

As the administrator of all these groups, I would say that "mediocre" authors are not threatening; will sell very few books; should be allowed to pursue their love of writing; will, as will everyone else, die someday having seen their work published. Better to have fulfilled a dream and die happy than always wonder if they missed out by not pursuing their dream.

I would add, Lane, that you unnecessarily threatened Ann about posting reviews on the Reviews Board. Instead of posting on the Reviews Board, Ann posted her review of Mr. Planemaker's Flying Machine here on the Chatter Box. That was silly of you to have such an impact on what should and should not be posted on the Reviews Board.

Shelagh,

Shelagh, I believe you would find that professional writers have nothing against amateurs. What they dislike is the cluttering of the marketplace with inferior products since the advent of the Internet.

Dick,

Without that cluttering, my books would not have been published. I would not have met you and all the other members of forums, networks and groups I've set up.

I do not rate myself as a writer. In fact, I wonder why I do it. I do not fall into the category of those who "have to write" or those who "love writing" or those who want to "make a difference."

I know a bit more than the average person about computer technology and I like the challenges of using computers to do things related to literature: writing, designing bookcovers, book layout, designing bookmarks.

The advent of the Internet allows me to pursue this interest. It allows thousands of people to believe that they can become published authors. On the 'net, that belief can turn into reality. If these new authors fool themselves into believing that, one day, their books will become sought after and read by hundreds of thousands of readers, then more fool them. The dream of being published can become real but the dream of becoming a best-selling author is a pipe dream.

Whatever your interests are, life is what YOU make out of it. Don't beat your drum to someone's tune. Use the great advice that comes from several people posting here, in real life, and elsewhere to help inform you, but be your own guide.

Charlie

ooops ... that should read someone elses tune above

Lane,

Some of the talk you see here is similar to what my generation, and perhaps yours, said at the watering hole across the street from the newspaper office.

People bitched about editors, the problems of making ends meet, the best sources for stories, etc. etc. While they did it in a bar, they still did it with no less hope and/or cynicism as people do here.

Had you walked into the bar where all the pros and cubs alike were engaging in such conversation and said "stop whining," I would have thrown a dart in your ass and received a standing ovation and a toast from the rowdy members for my pin point accuracy.

The fact that today's up-and-coming writers are talking on the Internet rather than at Bob's Lounge doesn't make the venting and the encouragement any less real or necessary than it was when you and I and Dick were starting out 50+ years ago.

Not that you're wrong about the points you made, but I see the tone as rather a discount of everyone here with fewer credits than you have.

Honey and a few encouraging words would make the medicine go down so much better.

As a 64-year-old guy who made a career out of his writing, I guess I have the right to say what I think here as well.

Malcolm

Lane's out of here-- I am too. Have a great time writing , whining, arguing, fighting.

I have a heap of living and laughing to do, it will be done elsewhere.

Dear Alice,
I am sorry you feel like that. I thought we were all friends. Some of us would like to be the next best seller and work our butts off in that direction.
Some of us are authors, not writers, some of us are poets, some of us are history fanciers, some us us would like to help people with our words, some of us would like to record our lives, some of us would like to tell about our hurts, and some of us just blurt out the words. There is room on this forum for us all.

If Lane wants to gather all his marbles that he ever wrote here and go on home, that is his option. No one told him to do it. He added to the forum.
What are we to feel about it now? He did it. No one else.
People have different thoughts. All are valid.

Love,
Betty

Lane made it clear that he is a professional and in the wrong company. He certainly took a dislike to anything I had to say and returned words that cut. I wish him the best in his career. Betty has clearly expressed that we are all individuals with different connections here; yet, we chat about many things and learn from each other in multiple ways. I receive inspiration and support and hope I share some info that others can use also.

I think people have their "seasons" that may bring them back to a forum or take them away for other exigencies of the moment. That's the beauty of this format - it allows for the ultimate in freedom of expression - or not.

Come on Alice and Lane, don't take your marbles and go.

Maybe Betty can grow some poppies and happy grass on her farm. We can u-pick, enjoy and mellow out. lol

LC,

I agree. They need to come back.

I also want you to know I took your criticism to heart and have been doing some major rewriting. The reason I know it is better is because it is making me cry, feel frightened, and I think I know where I am going. The writing is less encyclopedic, does not speak of authority, but of someone whose credentials are they were there and has spoken to others who were there. And indeed my words pale next to historians and journalist, but I am a fellow traveler here in the world.

That is way more than I intended to say. I'm trying to stay away. It isn't working.

Carol

If there's a message somewhere on this forum from Lane announcing he's leaving, I can't find it. If this is the case, I'm sorry to see him go.

This forum has for months been a place for a lot of heated arguments, so I'm wondering why Alice and Lane have chosen this moment and this thread as a rationale for leaving. This thread is actually one of the more polite arguments on the board.

Not knowing Lane's rationale for leaving, it's hard to comment.

Malcolm

Alice wrote:

Lane's out of here-- I am too. Have a great time writing , whining, arguing, fighting.

I have a heap of living and laughing to do, it will be done elsewhere.

Stop messing about, Alice. If you are still full of fun and laughter, why so serious? Where does visiting London next year fit into all this? I've already booked my flight.

Malcolm,

I'm with you!

?????

I certainly hope he doesn't leave. He adds a lot to this board.

I hope nobody leaves.

Ann

Me too.

Whenever one leaves, it is a loss. I think everyone here has contributions to make to the board. It doesn't mean that everyone will agree, or that it is all serious. Writing is serious, but levity can lighten the heart a little.

Perhaps Lane is just too busy to 'put up with us'.

Alice is being paged on her 'recovery' thread, so if she doesn't come back, her patients will soon be talking to the walls.