| Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it | |
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+5flashgordon Abe F. March Shelagh Jim Woods Malcolm 9 posters |
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Malcolm Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1504 Registration date : 2008-01-11 Location : Georgia
| Subject: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:06 am | |
| The handwriting has been on the wall for a long time. Now you can also find it in an interesting article in New York Magazine: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]Malcolm |
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Jim Woods Three Star Member
Number of posts : 171 Registration date : 2008-06-07
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:00 am | |
| Malcom, thanks for making that article available to us. Things do indeed look bleak. Makes me want to rush my WIP before print books become totally extinct. Jim Woods [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] |
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Shelagh Admin
Number of posts : 12662 Registration date : 2008-01-11 Location : UK
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:01 am | |
| Is that handwriting or handwringing? |
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Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:17 am | |
| Isn't that what we've been talking about for the past year? The change from traditional publishers to POD's and EBooks. Having a machine that will print out your book while you wait. I believe it will come down to impulse buying - the attraction of the cover and the title. It's a whole new ball game from what it was just two years ago. |
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Malcolm Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1504 Registration date : 2008-01-11 Location : Georgia
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:58 pm | |
| From the numbers, some of the problem can be fixed by getting rid of large advances.
Yes, Shelagh, there's quite a bit of handwringing in the equation as well.
Malcolm |
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flashgordon Four Star Member
Number of posts : 241 Registration date : 2008-01-11
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:02 pm | |
| I think this might actually be a good thing. Instead of getting the same books from the same authors over and over again (think Anne Rice), now a book will be based on whether it is good or not. So your name will carry some clout, but this opens up the door for all sorts of authors to get discovered by readers. Domination by the six big publishers (and their few authors) is slowly fading away. |
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Dick Stodghill Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3795 Registration date : 2008-05-04 Age : 98 Location : Akron, Ohio
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:17 pm | |
| I'm not so sure. Readers want books from the writers they like. That comes first, then if they have time they may take a look at others. Don't expect big-name writers to fall by the wayside in favor of someone publishing a POD book. |
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lin Five Star Member
Number of posts : 2753 Registration date : 2008-03-20 Location : Mexico
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:28 am | |
| How's this for an "end to publishing as we know it"?
Everybody reads on little iPod things that hold jillions of books, seeing the words in front on them on a large screen visible through the slim glasses they slip on, wirelessly connected to the device in their pocket.
They can go buy a hard cover book for $80 ($140 in countries with eco-taxes) or get a electronic version for a dollar or so.
They can search for writers on the net or subscribe to services that recommend new books to them. They often get books emailed to them by friends.
There are no advances. Writers who sell LOT'S of works make decent money, but most don't get rich. On the other hand, any writer can publish instantly, for free.
Thing is... how bad does that sound? And all that technology is here, right now. |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:57 pm | |
| What is important is for authors to keep writing. That is a right we have that is very important. We need to put our words out there in the world. We need to voice opinions, creativity, and make out voices heard in a world not always listening to regular citizens, but too often only the famous.
Last week a distant relative found one of my historical novels based on family, ordered it and anxiously awaited its arrival. Who knows who will stumble upon our books and find value in them.
Carol |
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Dick Stodghill Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3795 Registration date : 2008-05-04 Age : 98 Location : Akron, Ohio
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 2:46 pm | |
| The bad part of your idea, Lin, is that people who fall far short of being writers are already publishing books for free. They clutter up the marketplace and, should anyone read their book, give talented writers a bad name - tar them with the same brush. |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:02 pm | |
| Dick,
You're right. We also need to write with quality, not just quantity.
Marketability is the big factor, but we also need to make the writing the best we can.
Carol |
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Malcolm Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1504 Registration date : 2008-01-11 Location : Georgia
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 6:55 pm | |
| I agree Carol and Dick, though saying such things is likely to make a lot of people uncomfortable because they think having access to publishing via nontraditional methods equals democracy rather than a few more gems and a lot more junk.
Malcolm |
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zadaconnaway Five Star Member
Number of posts : 4017 Registration date : 2008-01-16 Age : 76 Location : Washington, USA
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:17 pm | |
| That is so true. I have read some appalling works in the past couple of years. Even spelling that was horrible! It really makes one wonder. |
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Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:19 pm | |
| In my view, any publisher regardless if traditional or other (and it is the other is fast expanding), who does not include or require editing, is a publisher to avoid. They help to trash the market.
As we have learned from the PA experience, it doesn't take long to gain a reputation, and when that happens, everyone involved becomes part of that reputation. It is very difficult to reverse a bad reputation. Editing at least can avoid spelling errors. A book that goes to print should be as free of errors as possible. Obviously when dialects, slang, foreign language expressions, etc., are used, a spell-checker is not a reliable source of editing. Censorship is something else entirely and a different subject. If a publisher elects to publish a book that lacks great appeal, that is subjective. I think we have all read books that were well written but dull. What about a great story that is poorly written? |
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Dick Stodghill Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3795 Registration date : 2008-05-04 Age : 98 Location : Akron, Ohio
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 5:31 am | |
| It's just one man's opinion, but I feel a great story that is poorly written is far worse than a dull but well-written book. |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 5:37 am | |
| Hopefully, as authors we are more discerning, especially when we have forums such as this and discussions.
Writing has to be both, well written and a good story. Many of the books I have read from authors here have been both.
And the third element is the marketability. Does a publisher think the book will sell? Are there enough people who will be interested in reading it?
A reputable publisher told me my Cuba book had been carefully considered and that it was a "fine work," but did not publish it because of marketability. I am not a famous general or journalist as many of the other authors of this publisher are. BUT, if the Cold War again heats up, there just might be a possible market, but that would not be a good thing.
Carol |
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Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:28 am | |
| Carol, no, that will/would not be a good thing. But it seems that there are those determined to make it happen either for political and/or monetary gain. |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 8:01 am | |
| Abe,
I am reading an excellent book by Bill Moyers, "On Democracy." It is pretty startling.
Wouldn't it be great if there were a publisher that published books by average citizens, who had done in-depth research, gave honest opinions about how government was impacting their lives? Perhaps these are the university students with thesis.
Carol |
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Dick Stodghill Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3795 Registration date : 2008-05-04 Age : 98 Location : Akron, Ohio
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 10:41 am | |
| Carol, you might consider Lulu. It produces exactly what you upload, including pictures. They do an excellent job and have live help available. The marketing is up to the writer but that is becoming the norm in publishing except for the Stephen Kings of the world. The only cost at Lulu unless you use one or more of the special services available is for an ISBN and a proof copy of your book. They place it on all online sites such as Amazon, B&N, etc. and it is available to book stores. Another use for Lulu is making a workbook for yourself. On a series that has been running in Alfred Hitchcock for 20 years I grew sick of checking the color of someone's hair, etc. by leafing through old magazines and file folders. I uploaded all the stories and now have a 6x9, 524 page workbook with a nice cover. It has made life easier. I now have done the same with other mystery short stories and novellas and went ahead and put the collections on the market. Now I have a neat row of finished books whenever I need to check on something. The one surprising thing was that I couldn't remember what stories written 20 or 30 years ago were about until looking them over again to put in one of the collections. One story I had completely forgotten about is now in Shelagh's anthology as a result. |
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Jim Woods Three Star Member
Number of posts : 171 Registration date : 2008-06-07
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:11 am | |
| I've probably, could say undoubtedly, passed over some good stories after reading the first poorly written or edited paragraph, page or chapter. I just won't spend my time on a story or book that is not written and edited within the standards that mark professional publishing--unless of course I'm the one paid to bring them up to standards. Language and styles have changed over the years but a well written and organized book bridges time and cultures. There are enough good books, and never enough time to pursue them all, to waste time on literary trash. Jim Woods [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 6:00 pm | |
| Dick,
That sounds like a good idea. Everything is either on my computer or printed up in binders. There are manuscripts I would like to edit in depth and having Lulu print them would be a good idea.
I like the workbook idea. This would work well for some travel manuscripts. For years I kept journals of our travels around the world with anecdotal stories. We have taken family along, grandsons, granddaughters, but I don't think any of them are ready for their adventures to be published, but putting all these travel stories in a workbook would work well.
Since I can't climb stairs to my desk, my husband is bringing all my work downstairs, so things will have to be downsized and those ideas would work.
My plans are to keep submitting the Cuba book, and I have had some good response and have a list of possible publishers, but the rest of my writing needs to be re-edited and organized, and being a bit incapacitated is a good time for this.
Carol |
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Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 6:00 pm | |
| Dick,
That sounds like a good idea. Everything is either on my computer or printed up in binders. There are manuscripts I would like to edit in depth and having Lulu print them would be a good idea.
I like the workbook idea. This would work well for some travel manuscripts. For years I kept journals of our travels around the world with anecdotal stories. We have taken family along, grandsons, granddaughters, but I don't think any of them are ready for their adventures to be published, but putting all these travel stories in a workbook would work well.
Since I can't climb stairs to my desk, my husband is bringing all my work downstairs, so things will have to be downsized and those ideas would work.
My plans are to keep submitting the Cuba book, and I have had some good response and have a list of possible publishers, but the rest of my writing needs to be re-edited and organized, and being a bit incapacitated is a good time for this.
Carol |
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lin Five Star Member
Number of posts : 2753 Registration date : 2008-03-20 Location : Mexico
| Subject: Re: Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it Sat Sep 20, 2008 6:23 pm | |
| - Quote :
- The bad part of your idea, Lin, is that people who fall far short of being writers are already publishing books for free. They clutter up the marketplace and, should anyone read their book, give talented writers a bad name - tar them with the same brush.
I'm not sure that's realistic. There are plenty of musicians and singers around. You hear them on street corners, see their videos on YouTube. Does that make you think all singers suck and stop listening to or buying music? The future of music, art, and literature is going to be different. There aren't the gallery costs and publishing costs anymore. The problem will be for people to find what they want. We are already seeing the birth and growth of structures, such as websites, that help in that task, the way travel guides help people sort out where they want to go in Europe or Asia. Writers are just starting to realize what many artistes already know: you're defined by your audience and your stature depends greatly on your ability to command it. |
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| Welcome to the end of publishing as we know it | |
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