| | Islam... | |
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+6Carol Troestler P. Gordon Kennedy Charlie Moore Domenic Pappalardo Abe F. March zelman 10 posters | Author | Message |
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zelman One Star Member
Number of posts : 23 Registration date : 2008-05-20 Age : 37 Location : USA
| Subject: Islam... Wed May 21, 2008 10:48 am | |
| I'm not sure how many people are even intrested in Islam, since 9/11 occured. I'm not even sure if anyone will like what I have to say on it. But as a convert to Islam, I thought I would do my best to expel myths regarding the religion of 1.7 billion people around the world. If you got any questions regarding anything related to this, post them here, and I'll do my best to answer them in a way that makes sense. I know for one thing that there is the issue of women in Islam wearing hijab(the headscarf that covers the hair, neck, and ears). Hijab isn't just the scarf that covers the hair. It's also the entire body covering in the Abaya(Abaya is a long loose robe that is made either of crepe or cotton). It's long enough to conceal the women's curves and her figure so she isn't a sex object for strange men. Islam values a woman's modesty so much that she covers it up and doesn't reveal it to anyone except her husband, sons, father, brothers, father in law, and certain other male members of her family. The Qur'an says in Sura 33:59 O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen their garments. Thus, they will be recognized (as righteous women) and avoid being insulted. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. This has nothing to do with women being inferior. Rather it is to protect the women from being lusted after on the street, or molested by strange men. A woman's hair is part of her beauty and that beauty could persuade bad men from harming her either sexually, or physically. God does not want men and women to be sex objects. By wearing the hijab, the woman is forcing men to respect her for her mind, not her body. She is showing him that she is a human being with rights, not a sex object to lust after and drool over by men who don't fear God. There is also a dress code for men which I will post in this topic. Sura 24:30 Tell the believing men that they shall subdue their eyes (and not stare at the women), and to maintain their chastity. This is purer for them. GOD is fully Cognizant of everything they do. So lowering the gaze is compulsory upon both man and woman, so they aren't tempted by the opposite sex and don't cheat on their spouse or do something else that is disgraceful not only to themselves but to their families as well. Anything in red is a passage from the Holy Qur'an that was revealed to the prophet Muhammad(SAW), in the cave of Mount Hijjah in Mecca by the Angel Gabriel. I should point out that I am not an Imam or a Sheikh, but if I don't know something I'll ask someone who does and then explain it on here. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Asking questions, no matter if they are bad or good is how people learn. |
| | | Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 21, 2008 11:29 am | |
| Zelman, education in all forms is welcome. Shelagh created this religious thread without restriction. Personally, I am familiar with what you have stated since I have studied much about Islam, Christianity and Judaism. I am not a religious fanatic nor would I even call myself a religious person. My objective was for understanding and I believe from what you have written, that is your objective.
I will be pleased to engage in discussions about religions for the sake of learning, but I will not personally get involved when it involves preaching. |
| | | zelman One Star Member
Number of posts : 23 Registration date : 2008-05-20 Age : 37 Location : USA
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 21, 2008 4:38 pm | |
| I agree with your Abe. That is why I'm not intending to preach but only to teach if people are of an open mind. is a charity in Islam. |
| | | Domenic Pappalardo Five Star Member
Number of posts : 2557 Registration date : 2009-04-27
| Subject: Re: Islam... Sun May 03, 2009 2:30 pm | |
| Can it be proven that the Qur'an is from God? |
| | | Charlie Moore Four Star Member
Number of posts : 213 Registration date : 2008-08-06
| Subject: Re: Islam... Sun May 03, 2009 4:38 pm | |
| Oftentimes learning about religion sounds very much like preaching. For that reason I normally stay away from religious discussions with people outside of my faith. Not always, however. This choice is not meant to be a slight to another religion in any way. My beliefs are strong and when I voice them they often come across as preaching (or so I'm told, even by members of my own faith) and people want the conversation to be comfortable. I am Christian and don't have an interest in Islam, but I wish you great success in this faith you have chosen.
Charlie |
| | | P. Gordon Kennedy Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1076 Registration date : 2008-01-13 Age : 35 Location : Crystal Falls, Michigan
| Subject: Re: Islam... Sun May 03, 2009 4:49 pm | |
| - domenic Pappalardo wrote:
- Can it be proven that the Qur'an is from God?
Not any more or less than it can be proven that the Bible is from god. |
| | | Domenic Pappalardo Five Star Member
Number of posts : 2557 Registration date : 2009-04-27
| Subject: Re: Islam... Sun May 03, 2009 7:02 pm | |
| - P. Gordon Kennedy wrote:
- domenic Pappalardo wrote:
- Can it be proven that the Qur'an is from God?
Not any more or less than it can be proven that the Bible is from god. Can you prove that statment? |
| | | P. Gordon Kennedy Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1076 Registration date : 2008-01-13 Age : 35 Location : Crystal Falls, Michigan
| Subject: Re: Islam... Sun May 03, 2009 7:52 pm | |
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| | | Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 8:14 am | |
| Marie, you are in touch with reality. There are fanatics/extremists in all religions. We most often hear about the extremes. Whether it be Islam, Judaism, Christianity or whatever, when someone commits a crime they are often branded by their religion. The impression by many people is that all Muslims are terrorists and that their religion supports terrorist acts. Those who think that or make statements implying that, are ignorant. By the same token, statements that Christians are good and trustworthy is also a statement of ignorance. |
| | | Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 9:05 am | |
| Abe and Marie,
I'm with you. I also believe there are a lot of prayers said in schools, public and nonpublic place, like people's homes, and God doesn't live just in religious places.
And once again I am upset by activities in the Catholic Church. A woman who was a pastoral assistant was asked to rescind her college thesis where she said more woman and gays should be included in church ceremonies. How can you rescind words in a college thesis? And I am with her in her belief that women need to be included, all women, not just those who are "good" Catholic women who go along with all the beliefs and ignore thoughts of their own. I am not one of those. I grew up in a more democratic religion where I was taught to ponder and wonder, always.
Carol |
| | | Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 9:11 am | |
| Marie,
I remember those days. I was the non-Catholic in love with a Catholic. He believed that once someone learned about the Catholic Church, they would believe, that it was that lack of knowledge that stood in the way. Wrong.
And I had family and friends from my religion who didn't even come to my wedding in the Catholic Church. But somehow I became part of some sort of familial ecumenical movement. A cousin called recently and said I knew what I was doing, and a friend broke down in tears one day for not supporting me.
And I know so many women and men who did not marry the love of their lives because of these divisions, but never forgot.
Carol |
| | | alj Five Star Member
Number of posts : 9633 Registration date : 2008-12-05 Age : 80 Location : San Antonio
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 9:38 am | |
| I first read Owen Wister's classic, The Virginian, when I was in high school. The book was written in 1902, and is now public domain, so I hope the following excerpt isn't too long. It made a strong impact on my thinking back then. It still resonates for me. - Quote :
- “How many religions are there?"
"All over the earth?" "Yu' can begin with ourselves. Right hyeh at home I know there's Romanists, and Episcopals--" "Two kinds!" I put in. "At least two of Episcopals." "That's three. Then Methodists and Baptists, and--" "Three Methodists!" "Well, you do the countin'." I accordingly did it, feeling my revolving memory slip cogs all the way round. "Anyhow, there are safely fifteen." "Fifteen." He held this fact a moment. "And they don't worship a whole heap o' different gods like the ancients did?" "Oh, no!" "It's just the same one?" "The same one." The Virginian folded his hands over the horn of his saddle, and leaned forward upon them in contemplation of the wide, beautiful landscape. "One God and fifteen religions," was his reflection. "That's a right smart of religions for just one God." ….."Do you think there ought to be fifteen varieties of good people?" His voice, while it now had an edge that could cut anything it came against, was still not raised. "There ain't fifteen. There ain't two. There's one kind. And when I meet it, I respect it. It is not praying nor preaching that has ever caught me and made me ashamed of myself, but one or two people I have knowed that never said a superior word to me…. "As for parsons "--the gesture of his arm was a disclaiming one--"I reckon some parsons have a right to tell yu' to be good. The bishop of this hyeh Territory has a right. But I'll tell yu' this: a middlin' doctor is a pore thing, and a middlin' lawyer is a pore thing; but keep me from a middlin' man of God." Ann |
| | | Abe F. March Five Star Member
Number of posts : 10768 Registration date : 2008-01-26 Age : 85 Location : Germany
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 10:17 am | |
| Ann, there simply too much middlin' |
| | | Don Stephens Five Star Member
Number of posts : 1355 Registration date : 2008-01-25 Age : 85 Location : Wherever my hat's hanging today!
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 12:45 pm | |
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Last edited by D. J. (Don) Stephens on Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
| | | Carol Troestler Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3827 Registration date : 2008-06-07 Age : 86 Location : Wisconsin
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 1:39 pm | |
| Don,
And I think the church missed out on a good priest. I knew a few in graduate school for social work who were still ministering to people, but in a way they could deal with. It is about integrity.
My sister-in-law was a nun and her husband was a brother. Neither one has regretted leaving their vocations. One night several years ago, when their daughters were teenagers, they got a call from one of them. "Dad," she said hesitantly, "can you tell my friends what you and Mom were? My friends won't believe me."
Carol |
| | | Dick Stodghill Five Star Member
Number of posts : 3795 Registration date : 2008-05-04 Age : 98 Location : Akron, Ohio
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 3:49 pm | |
| Wister was a wise man. I have a copy of "The Virginian" in my bookcase and look it over now and then. Think I told you we had lunch at the hotel in Medicine Bow where he did some of his writing. |
| | | zadaconnaway Five Star Member
Number of posts : 4017 Registration date : 2008-01-16 Age : 76 Location : Washington, USA
| Subject: Re: Islam... Wed May 06, 2009 8:53 pm | |
| Ann, your quote is perfect. |
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