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 Why is Everyone Outraged?

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alice
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PostSubject: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Sat Oct 08, 2016 2:20 pm

Donald Trump has said disgusting things all along.  Why be offended now?
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Sun Oct 09, 2016 12:31 am

Exactly.
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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Sun Oct 09, 2016 8:47 am

10/9

        I think it's more disgusting what Bill Clinton did and he got away with it ! Shows you
two different justices in the USA the haves and have nots !


                                                 Cheers...Joe... Very Happy
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Mon Oct 10, 2016 1:01 am

My son made a good point that Hillary could have used.  When she made her marriage vows she took "for better or for worse" seriously - and she did it only once.
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alice
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:52 am

I wish we had better choices.  NancY Pelosi has no scandels that I am aware of
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Shelagh
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Mon Oct 10, 2016 2:04 pm

Abe F. March wrote:
My son made a good point that Hillary could have used.  When she made her marriage vows she took "for better or for worse" seriously - and she did it only once.

If she can forgive her own husband, she should be capable of showing the same degree of forgiveness to all other husbands. It's Hillary Clinton's double standards that many voters find unacceptable.

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:53 pm

Shelagh, things look different when viewed from afar, as it is with us. 
Trump’s running mate went on TV with a religious expose on how his Christian values allows him to forgive what Trump said due to “Grace”.  That same attitude/Grace does not apply to Democrats?
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:23 am

Hillary forgave her husband on national television and asked the nation to vote for him. She did not say that a man who performed a sexual act on a young intern in the oval office was unfit to be president. That is the benchmark she set, which is about as low as you can get when determining what presidential nominees are allowed to say and do. She is in no position whatsoever to judge Donald Trump. Just saying.

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dkchristi
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:27 am

You took the words right out of my brain, Abe.  I thought exactly the same when I listened to Pence. 

Infidelity and coping with it is a complicated issue handled much different emotionally by women and men.

Same for objectifying women and speaking about them in graphic and demeaning ways - so they are body parts for a man's enjoyment rather than human.  Fortunately, enlightened men who appreciate the complexity of knowing women as equals are also appalled by people like Trump.  Take away Trump's money and you are left with an empty shell of a human being with no friends and likely no children either. 

Women are programmed to forgive men everything in order to keep a provider for the family. It is hard wired even though women today do at least 50% and more of the "providing."  Forgiveness, however, comes in steps unless there's a "religious conversion."  The steps are similar to those for death.

First, disbelief.  Second, profound grief and depression (rage turned inside out) and Third, rage. Fourth, acceptance and last in cases of infidelity, a conditional forgiveness (except for a religious conversion. 

The rage is from a primeval place that is beyond understanding unless you have been raised as a woman to believe in marriage and fairy tales and love forever after.  After forgiveness, the goal is to protect the family unit, save the income, save the children, and have some sort of future beyond. That Hillary had to experience infidelity in the public arena under such circumstances and then to be criticized for forgiveness, the very "Grace" that Pence is so full of toward Trump, is proof again that Trump has  no class whatsoever nor do the people that criticize Hillary for being a woman with a woman's emotions and a human being's hopes and dreams.

Donald Trump's total lack of class is and has been evident. It's the supreme case of male hypocrisy for a man whose infidelities are legion and who has had children by three wives, each a trophy wife who he met while married to the last one, and the last wife pregnant when they married.  I am beginning to feel sorry for Melania. Money makes life comfortable, but she still has to sleep with the man to get it.  He gives me the creeps.

I remember the Korean Kiesings who are similar to Japanese Geisha's that became my friends in Korea.  One said to me, "the difference between a paid Kiesing and an American wife is the wedding ring and the expectation of fidelity.  Many American wives stay for the money too."  Sometimes, there isn't enough money.
And even if there is, the broken marriage is beyond repair.  But mostly, women stay and forgive and in that forgiveness blame the other women so they can live with the man.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:16 am

Interesting comments, DK.  Sometimes what one may consider as forgiveness is nothing more than acceptance for the reasons you stated.  Children have kept families together.  Time is a healer.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:31 am

Hillary Clinton forgave her husband publically to help him become president. Who goes on television to announce their forgiveness to the world unless there's something in it for them?

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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:10 pm

Since she decided to continue living with him and keeping the home intact for their daughter, she was certainly going to support his presidency as the family breadwinner and her spouse.  I would do the same - whatever it took.  Most women who decide to live with philandering husbands support them in public for the sake of the family.  In other words, if I forgive him why can't you?  What's in it for her is the career of her husband, the future for herself and her child.  That's plenty.  After Donald Trump's remarks, Melania should divorce him and his adult children should estrange themselves from him.  Right.  They all know where their future lies - his money and power. 

In fact, if you follow Pence's little Grace talk, all is forgiven immediately.  The Clintons and the Trumps are free of their sins in the eyes of a forgiving God.  Well, he left out the Clintons, but Pence assured everyone that God is giving Trump the Grace he needs.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:14 pm

A friend of mine's spouse had a girlfriend.  My friend separated and her family and friends congratulated her.  But they  had been together for many years is a very loving relationship and the girl was a mistake. 

My friends relatives told her that her husband would have to prostrate himself in front of the church to get forgiveness and until then was possessed of the devil and not allowed among the family.

My friend forgave him.  He did not prostrate himself.  Finally, the family came around.  Time does heal some things if not entirely.  Remaining married was the right thing for them as they find joy in their children and grandchildren today.

Judge not lest ye be judged.  However, feel free to speak out against reprehensible behavior.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:28 pm

Your logic is beyond me, DK.

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:11 am

Is it a human trait to see the evil/bad in others?  Is judging part of that trait?  Could being in the shoes of those we judge change our thinking?  Do you know anyone who doesn't have something in their past that they are ashamed of? 
Forgiveness should wipe the slate clean, but it doesn't.  Even acceptance of wrong-doing can be reversed given the right circumstances.  People running for public office lose their privacy status and if they have something to hide (as many do) it can and will be used against them. 
We once had a President that was squeaky clean - an honest man.  That did not keep him free of criticism nor did it make him a great President in the eyes of many.  President Carter is alive and still working for the good will of man.  Even with all his goodness, I suspect if one dug deep enough they could find fault. 
We tend to ignore the faults of those we like and demonize those we dislike.  is that not what is happening with this election?  Capability to do a job is not based on morals.  Seeking to punish/kill those we dislike should send a signal about the person.  The safety/security/welfare of those to be governed is a priority.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:19 am

10/12

             The Clintons could never, ever be forgiven for all the evil dirty under handed
things they've done....God hates ugly and these two are ugly... So figure out what it
means: " God Hates Ugly,"

                                                        Cheers......Joe......
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:03 am

I can't speak for God.  I have only scripture to provide some indication of what he likes or dislikes.  If one is referencing the old testament, you may see a God of wrath.  If you reference the New Testament, you see a God of Love and forgiveness.  
Who knows what is in the heart of an individual?  Who knows if they asked for forgiveness and that it was granted as promised? 
The past cannot be changed.  There is no "undo" button to erase our mistakes.  Forever condemnation is not my take on the teachings of Christ.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:59 am

10/12

            My step-father told me this as a teenager, " God Hates Ugly," he told me if someone
does something nasty, evil, or even try to harm you, you never have to lift a finger because
what they do always comes back to them, and you know what I've seen it over the years he
was right....So the Clinton's will not be in power, my prediction...

                                                       Cheers..............Joe............
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alice
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 11:01 am

Time will tell.  Either one scares me.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:15 pm


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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:12 pm

At last a meme that makes sense and isn't half-truths or ugliness.  Thank you, Shelagh.

Abe, I like your analysis of forgiveness, a loving God, etc. 

For those believing what they read about either candidate, go to Snopes.com and other fact-checking places and see just how slanted the stuff we read is - turning information into such drama and lies that people actually believe they "hate" people they do not know except through the printed lies.

The lies that are the ugliest seem to catch on the fastest and told often enough become "ugly truths."

I see Facebook full of them as well as many of the Memes.  That's why Shelagh's post was refreshing.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Thu Oct 13, 2016 12:14 am

Agree, DK. 

You may have observed that Trump will often preceed a statement with "To tell you the truth..."  Does that mean that everything else he said was false?
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Thu Oct 13, 2016 8:12 am

Who would know,   Abe.I want standards for presidential candidates.
They should  be interviiewed for the the job
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Thu Oct 13, 2016 11:50 am

I agree Alice.  Not only intervewed, but tested.  I realize that they are elected and not hired, however they should be held to the same standards as any other government employee or servant of the people.  It is not just knowledge about government, but also about the world in general.  Knowing who the leaders are, by name.  Knowing their geographic location is not something to overlook.  A world leader requires knowledge.
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PostSubject: Re: Why is Everyone Outraged?   Thu Oct 13, 2016 12:56 pm

Abe F. March wrote:
I agree Alice.  Not only intervewed, but tested.  I realize that they are elected and not hired, however they should be held to the same standards as any other government employee or servant of the people.  It is not just knowledge about government, but also about the world in general.  Knowing who the leaders are, by name.  Knowing their geographic location is not something to overlook.  A world leader requires knowledge.
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