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 The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"

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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sat Nov 07, 2015 9:18 am

Last night i watched, "WW2 from the German point of view," on you tube.
Many of the events in this I had known...the full details turned my heart to shame for being human. We think of the United States as a land of freedom under God...how we have been blinded to what the rest of the world sees.

I suggest those who love truth, watch this shocking truth of history.
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Shelagh
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sat Nov 07, 2015 3:52 pm

The Germans are not allowed a point of view. They started the war, and they lost. They should get over themselves.

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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sat Nov 07, 2015 6:56 pm

A year before England, and France declared war on Germany, Germans in Poland were being killed. That section of Poland was Germany before the end of WW1. Hitler asked both England, and France to help save the Germans in Poland.  That request went on for a year, and Hitler was given no reply. I don’t think he should have invaded Poland. The Germans in Poland could moved into Germany. I don’t know what conversation on the subject went on behind closed doors, but something should have been done? 
It is true Germany started WW2.  My personal feelings on it: Before Hitler, the Germans had to pay for WW1, and many Germans were out of work, and starving. I believe this played a part in the power given to Hitler. Yes Hitler was a bad man, and it can be said he started WW2. But I also believe France, England, and the United States wanted war, after all, the world was in a great depression, and war always gives people work, and ends depressions.
Because of Hitler, millions died. The killing should have stopped when the war ended…it did not. Both Russia, and the United States, with the help of France, and England, murdered millions of Germans. POW’s were listed as “Disarmed Combatants.” This took the POW’s out of the protection of the rule of POW.
The Americans starved 1.7 million German POW’s after the war. We have no idea how many the Russians murdered?
The Germans during the war, followed the rule of POW’s…American, English, and French were not murdered.
To do what the United States, England, France, and Russia did to not only POW’s, but civilians…was detestable. Too sweep it under the rug of history would be evil. I for one, am ashamed to be part of the human race for all the wrong, vile things we have done.
True many Germans beside Hitler did bad things, but so did many in the American, English, and Russian armies. 
All of our movies, and history books paint the Germans as bad…the truth is, the whole world was bad. The whole world did evil. 
What breaks my heart…is humans are still doing evil…world wide, and they think they are doing, and dying for their country, their rights, their race…and a million other stupid reasons to murder each other.  We are a sick, sick people. I do not care if most do not believe in God…but it will take a God to stop this madness.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 12:03 am

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 6:59 am

Cause of WW I
http://americanhistory.about.com/od/worldwari/tp/causes-of-world-war-1.htm
 
Cause of WW II
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_World_War_II
 
For a quick view/answer, one can Google and get various references.  None of these references are a substitute for actual recorded history.  It could be said that World War Two resulted from the penalties imposed from World War One. It is therefore WWI that needs some examination and the mentality of the Victors who would impose such harsh penalties.
 
What we are taught about these events are often from the point of view of the victor.  Prejudice instilled in young people is carried forward from generation to generation.  The victor makes the rules that tend to cloud historical events.
.   
When I took my morning walk, I thought about the post Domenic made and didn’t feel that my one word “Good Post” could be left at that.  My thoughts were directed to how our feelings and prejudices are formed.  I remembered the early western movies “Cowboys and Indians” The Indians were depicted as the bad guys. There was no reference to pushing the natives off their land and their reason for revenge.  We pledged allegiance to the flag.  A true patriot supported our government – right or wrong. Then there were the war movies that glorified our fighting men.  In my military basic training we were told who our enemies were.  Hate was instilled in us to make us better fighting men.  Rather than hating a specific government, the hate was directed toward any person with the national identity of the country we were told was our enemy. 
Religion was a big part of my early indoctrination.  Any denomination that didn’t believe as the philosophy of our church was wrong and they were going to hell. 
Ignorance was the culprit.  Ignorance continues regarding religion, national identity and race.  Patriotism can be blinding.  During the Vietnam War there were those who objected and were ostracized for their “unpatriotic” views.  We had a Civil War – north against the south – a devastating war with lasting effects.  There are those in the North who still look down on people from the South and vise versa.  Recently the Confederate Flag became a symbol of contention.  Opinions are formed at an early age and even with enlightenment, some of those ingrained feelings remain.  Those seeking “truth” dig into history for answers and do not accept public or “popular” views as gospel.  Much of what we read or hear from the media can be prejudiced.  That is particularly true with reporting about the Middle East.  Stories submitted by reporters are edited to reflect the views of the Station Head.  Sometimes the Reporter’s story is rejected outright and truth is hidden. 
As for the two World Wars, Germans are still views by many as Nazis.  The leaders/perpetrators of evil are long gone, but the stigma remains.  None of us decided to be born nor did we have a say in what our nationality would be.  As adults we have the ability to change our views and even our national identity if desired.  A National identity can be good or bad depending on the actions of ones government.  Forgiveness is promoted as a “Christian” value, yet many who proclaim Christianity are not willing to forgive.  Our past cannot be changed.  How we view the past can help us to avoid making similar blunders.  Seeking truth can be a perpetual task.  Asking questions is a learning process.
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 7:24 am

War brings out the worst in people; it also brings acts of kindness. During WWl, the soldiers left their trenches one Christmas morning and organised a football match, England v Germany. The next day, they were killing one another again. At the end of WWll, Dick and his fellow infantrymen showed compassion towards a German soldier who wanted to carve a toy for his young son. Dick wrote about it here:

http://www.publishedauthors.org/t3696-a-christmas-story

The British Isles have been occupied many times over the centuries: by the Romans, the French and the Germans. Our rich language is testimony to the fact. Had Germany won the war, once again we would be ruled by Germany. It was worth winning the war to avoid that fate, despite the tremendous loss of so many lives.

Raking up past war misdemeanours will achieve nothing. Remembering the brave men who fought for our freedom is a far better use of history.

Maxwell Edmonds is credited with authorship of a famous epitaph in the War Cemetery in Kohima which commemorates the fallen of the Battle of Kohima in April 1944:

When you go home, tell them of us and say
For their tomorrow, we gave our today.


He was the author of an item in The Times, 6 February 1918, page 7, headed "Four Epitaphs" composed for graves and memorials to those fallen in battle – each covering different situations of death. The second of these was used as a theme for the 1942 war movie ''Went the Day Well?''

Went the day well?
We died and never knew.
But, well or ill,
Freedom, we died for you.


That epitaph was regularly quoted when The Times notified deaths of those who fell during the First World War, and was also regularly used during the Second World War. It appeared on many village and town war memorials.

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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:06 am


Abe, you are in Germany...you hear what Germans say that we do not. You have heard, "Truth" from both sides.
Shelagh,
People follow their government into war, following sayings like, “For God, and country, Remember this, or that.” When it is done we honor the dead as hero’s, and the loser as evil. Hitler did not want to destroy the men at Dunkirk. He said of the English, “They are the same as us.” He did not want war with England. It was England, and France who declared war on Germany. All the little people believed their government was on the right side. If the dead of the winner are to be honored, the dead of the loser should also be honored. It is believed 60 million Germans died during, the years, 1939,and 1947. Yes, many Germans were murdered by the winners after the war ended. The U.S. Army starved 1.7 million POW’s after the war. Civilians were also starved…the winners wanted to kill all the Germans. That is truth. The Berlin airlift was not to save Germans, it was to resist the Russians. Hitler may have been evil, but the deeds of the winner were also evil. I do not think we should honor the fallen in war, I think we should weep for them…they were the victims of evil. 
Jesus spoke of two seeds on this earth, “The wheat, and the Tars.” The Tars are children of Satan, and the scriptures say, Satan is the god of this system…who he wants he puts into authority. Maybe to find the truth, we should not looking at each other, but reason on an invisible force that is evil.
I do not honor those who died in war as hero’s but as victims. Not just the winner, but also the loser…because they are both victims…there are no winners.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:16 am

http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/05/01/Royal_Nazis.html
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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:36 am

Abe,
There is a scripture which says,"It will be brother, against brother." It seems the war between England, and Germany was, "Brother against brother."
Who did Hitler declare war on? It was England, France, and the U.S who declared war on Germany. Hitler after a year of effort trying to get England, and France to stop the murder of Germans in Poland, that he invaded Poland. He did declare war on Russia. After WW2, the U.S, England, and France were against Russia...was Hitler right?
Here is one truth I know. Evil people start wars. The innocent fight each other and millions of them die. The evil are always in control. God says the war against the evil force is not one humans can fight...it is God alone who can, and will stop it. History prove man can''t stop it...it just keeps going on, and it is not over, The future holds an evil time like the world has never seen before...and God will put an end to it.
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:41 am

The influenza or flu pandemic of 1918 to 1919, the deadliest in modern history, infected an estimated 500 million people worldwide–about one-third of the planet’s population at the time–and killed an estimated 20 million to 50 million victims. More than 25 percent of the U.S. population became sick, and some 675,000 Americans died during the pandemic. The 1918 flu was first observed in Europe, the U.S. and parts of Asia before swiftly spreading around the world. Surprisingly, many flu victims were young, otherwise healthy adults. At the time, there were no effective drugs or vaccines to treat this killer flu strain or prevent its spread.

Suffering and death is part of the human condition; trying to apportion blame to wars that occured in the last century is a futile exercise. Learn from the past, live in the present and make the world a better place for the future.

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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:23 am

Shelagh said:

"Suffering and death is part of the human condition; trying to apportion blame to wars that occured in the last century is a futile exercise. Learn from the past, live in the present and make the world a better place for the future."

18 years after WW1 ended, I was born. Within 60 years from the start of WW1, 1914...man jumped off the horse, and was riding an electric car on the moon? For thousands of years things were the same...what was so special about those 60 years following 1914? Have we done anything to make the world a better place for the future? Almost every nation has atomic weapons...the leaders of some of those nations tell their people, "If you die killing those who do not believe as we do, you will go to Heaven, and have ten virgins." There are others, like North Korea who are just mad. All the world leaders have strong bunkers to withstand an atomic war...it is the people who will die.
The world leaders do not make the world a better place...they make it a more dangerous place.
Millions are starving, or dying from sickness. Thousand are fleeing their home lands, looking for a save place. Race is against race, culture is against culture, religion is against religion...even the earth we stand on is in rebellion.
Make the world a better place for the future? Man has proven he can not do do that. I will tell you a truth: There is an evil force behind what happens in this world. That force will make things very bad. When it seem there is no hope, that force will present himself as the savor of mankind. He will do many great things...people will have to follow him, or die...a very bad time will come. Half way into that time Jesus will come, and all eyes will see him...he says he will come, "not to make peace, but with a sword." Those who believe in him will be saved, and those who do not he will leave. God will come, and he says, "I will destroy every living thing on earth."
I have no idea when this will take place, nor does it matter...but take place it will. That is a truth the world will not believe until it happens.

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:30 am

Monday, November 02, 2009


Do you know what it means to suffer?


It was one of those rare times when you couldn't ask for a single thing that would make life better. The brutal fighting in and around the town of Mortain was over and that meant the Battle of Normandy was over. More war lay ahead but at the moment all that mattered was the warm sunlight falling on a grassy hillside and the quiet that seemed so tangible you could reach out and touch it, store a little of it away in your pockets.
Then a chaplain came walking by, a hellfire and brimstone preacher who saw us as a captive audience. He stopped and looked us over with disgust.
"You're soft," he cried in a high-pitched voice laced with the hills and hollows of Appalachia. "You don't know what it means to suffer. You don't know what it means to be really hungry. Well I know and I'm going to tell you."
No one had informed him that some of the men sitting by themselves off to the left were from the 30th Infantry Division. For a week they had been surrounded on a hillside with nothing to eat but some unripe apples and hard potatoes they had dug from the ground.
So he told them and the rest of us who'd been eating high on the hog what it was like to be really hungry.
"After breakfast one morning I went for a walk in the woods and got lost. It was ten-thirty at night before I got back. All that time I didn't have a thing to eat. That's what it means to be hungry. That's what it means to suffer."
One by one the men from the 30th got up and walked away. One by one the rest of us did the same.
Well, it was nice while it lasted.
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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:38 am

Dick was a good man, or should I say, a good youth. He believed he was on the right side. Most of the Germans were also good men, or should I say, good youth. who also believed they were on the right side.  Both sides had loved ones. All wanted to live, and go home to a hot meal, and a warm bed. They all saw death. Bodies of friends, and parts of bodies of friends...strangers too. some of the dead were just children...most looked like they were sleeping., all but their color. Their color made one turn away. Fear never left. It followed close...your second shadow. It was hard to remember days, even hours before. There was always the present...there is no escape.  I wet my pants sometime during the night. They are still wet. Nobody says anything about my wet pants. Most of the other guys wet their pants too. Our Captain was killed today. He fell on something, and it killed him. We thought they would let us go home now that he was dead, but instead they sent a new officer to tell us what to do.
He wants us to stand at attention when he talks to us. Nobody pays attention to him...we just stay in our hole, and wait for this new officer to get shot.
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:16 pm

World War II was well over by the time I came along.  It look as  though ISOS will begin World War III with their downing of the passenger plane last week  Sad.
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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Sun Nov 08, 2015 2:25 pm

Alice, It does not matter who starts what, if it was not for one side, it would be the other. You are a Christian with Bible training...you know these things are going to take place, and lead to Har-Magedon.
God says, "When you see these things, rejoice for your salvation is near," I have been thinking all these past years, "How does one rejoice?" It scares the hell out of me, as I know it does most Christians. I have told God my feeling on the matter..."Father, have you not seen enough?" Before he caused the Great Flood, he waited until there was only one man left that was good, Noah. I hope he is not waiting again until there is only one person left who is good?
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Mon Nov 09, 2015 5:05 pm

Thanks, Shelagh.  I loved that story of Dick's and used it once in my inspirational reading at church.  I'd lost track and now have it again.
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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:47 pm

Dick was a great writer, and a great story teller. He was 18 in the last few years of WW2. I have seen him on talk shows, which are still on the net. He was also in Korea. I was in the last few months of that war..Dick was older, and talked little about that time. You might say he was two men, in two different wars. WW2 was won when the Americans, and britts made a beach head on Normandy. Before that landing, the 8th air force had destroyed the German air force. The Germans had no air cover, and moving troops, and equipment during they day was suicide. It was a war we knew we had won before it was over. Korea was very different. We knew we could not win. That war was fought not by generals, but by Washington D.C. The mood of the men was different. When they came home, nobody cared. A few men like Dick spoke for those who were silent about WW2. Most men went to the grave never speaking of the things they saw. I had an uncle who died several months ago. He was on Iwo the full 36 days of hell. He never spoke of it, not one work. Iwo was a 24/7 war for 36 days. We had four times the men than the Japanese on Iwo. It was the only battle in WW2 that we lost more men than the enemy. I respect anyone, man, or women who fought in any war...but I also understand those on both sides were the victim, and my feeling go out to both, be they civilian, or combatants. I don't like good war stories...they just make young men want to go to war for a glory that is not there.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:20 pm

Domenic, I share your feelings about war.
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Domenic Pappalardo
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:36 pm

Abe, most of the men who came home from war, feel the same way. I watched a talk show they had with Murphy. The number one American hero. They were asking him about this battle, and that battle. He was replying, "I don't remember being here, or there. The whole time is like being in a fog." He didn't remember much except the fear of every second. I wondered how he wrote the book, "To hell, and back?" I think some one else wrote it for him, based on what was found in his record.
WW1 was a stupid war. A ruler, and his wife get killed by one man, and the whole world goes to war and millions die?
Those who cme back from war, and talk about it, have not seen what those who stay silent have...men on both sides are the victims.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Tue Nov 10, 2015 7:46 am

In America there was no therapy for war veterans.  They had to deal with it alone.  Those who could talk it out were able to re-adjust and return to a normal life.  Most couldn't.  What they held inside (the horrors they witnessed along with the faces of those they killed) would haunt them for the rest of their lives. 
When we hear about cuts in Veterans benefits or decreased care it is hard to fathom.  How any country would send men to war and then drop them when the war was over or when they had served their time is IMV, criminal.  It is much like using a throw-away product. 

Dick was exceptional.  I think a good part of his therapy was writing the book.  In addition, he praised the Veterans Medical Center that he used.  They were an exception to the norm. 

I finished the book I had been reading and went to my bookshelf to find something to read.  I toyed between re-reading a book by Don Stephens or Dick Stodghill.  Since we were talking about Dick, I chose Dick's book.  The Forward to the book covers some of the things we are discussing.  It is a timely read for me.
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PostSubject: Re: The Roman pilate asked, "What is truth?"   Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:25 am

Abe,
Writing is therapy. I watched several interviews dick had that are still on you tube. He was a strong man, but he still hurt for those who died in the war. I remember on a different forum, people were putting him down for publishing his war book with, "Publish America." He told them face up, "I'm old, and wanted to leave my story for my family." I guess the book was like saying, "This is the man the war has made me." I think he was speaking for those who could not speak. Yes, people are used in war, then thrown away. War is a criminal act...for both sides. That is not to say the men who had to fight the war are criminal, those who sent them will have a price to pay when they stand before God.
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