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alice
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:34 am

These poor people NEED HELP and need it Fast.

I never  thought of all the problems  Abe and DK so aptly described.
DK Is right to call for the Christians.  It would be better than a sermon to  help these unfortunates.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Nov 04, 2015 1:15 am

This morning in Estonia they agreed to take 150 migrants.  One lady interviewed said: "This is terrible.  Our cows will see a black person and won't give milk anymore."

Although 150 is a small number, it is large when they are placed in a town of 250 citizens.  Another woman said:  "God gave people different skin color and countries for them to live in.  People should live in the countries according to their skin color."
 
Problems associated with race/discrimination has not been eradicated.  Some are just now feeling the effects of it.  With some it is religion while with others it is the color of ones skin.  That is the world we live in.  Strife will continue to play a role with human relationships.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:24 am

As expected, the “open arms” welcome to refugees/migrants is having an effect on German society.  On New Year’s Eve, an estimated 1,000 migrants (primarily from North Africa) entered the train station in Köln (Cologne) Germany rounding up the women.  They stole their cell phones and money and some were physically assaulted.  Some of the girls/women said the men ran their hands up under their skirts as they fought to defend themselves.  Approximately 150 policemen entered to break up the fray, but there was little they could do with so many.  Arrests were made and it is assumed that they will be deported.  Some women expressed the fear of going out into the streets, especially in small towns where the roving gangs suddenly appear.  The migrants from North Africa are easier to identify based on the color of their skin.  Whereas race would not normally play a role, it will be a problem and those with dark skin will be suspect.
A police spokesman said that they think it is part of an organized gang.  A similar incident occurred in Hamburg, Germany.  Alerts are being made to notify police when strangers enter a town/village.  Protection is with the police as it should be.
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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 06, 2016 8:42 pm

1/6/2016

                  I believe Merkel should be horse whipped and thrown out of power !
I read about what happened in Germany about the attacks on women some said
they were raped, I was shocked , I believe Merkel should be held responsible..

                                          Cheers............Joe............ Very Happy
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 06, 2016 10:17 pm

Being held responsible for doing a humnatarian thing that turned sour should not be condemned out of hand.  Doing good can backfire.  Doing nothing is worse.  Imagine the flack Merkel would have taken if she had refused to accept the refugees.  The overwhelming numbers arriving in a short a period of time didn't allow sufficient time for preparation.  Not having enough people in place for screening and registration contributed to the problem.  Even with tough screening, there would still be some radical elements slipping through.  False ID's, fabricated stories without means to verify is difficult.
Dealing with the problem, regardless of the cause, takes priority over why or who is to blame.  Placing blame doesn't solve the problem.  To say it is a mess is a mild expression.  Women have been attacked in isolated instances in most countries.  When it happens in great numbers it gets more attention.  How to stop these attacks is the current focus.  If there was an easy solution, it would be found.  Trying to sort out the good migrants from the bad makes the job more difficult.  Human Rights comes into play and one cannot punish all for the actions of some.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:47 am

Over 600,000 young single men are in Germany as refugees/migrants.  One of them went to Paris last week and assaulted people as they were conducting a memorial service.  He was shot and they learned that he had seven identities and was registered in seven different locations.  These refugees/migrants receive an allowance and it is believed he used different identities to collect money from each location.
To say that there is a problem is an understatement.  Sorting it out will take a long time.  In the meanwhile more criminal activity can be expected.  Unfortunately the needy - the genuine refugees will suffer.
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Shelagh
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Tue Jan 12, 2016 7:44 am

Europe is in crisis, mainly because of weak leadership from America and the European leaders. Obama has been the worst thing to happen in the last eight years. Rightly or wrongly, the world relies on America for leadership. With a pacifist at the helm, America has been emasculated and lost most of its power. This is the sorry state of Europe today, with little hope for a solution until America becomes strong again: 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12090388/Europe-in-crisis-over-sex-attacks-by-migrants-amid-calls-for-emergency-EU-meeting.html

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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Tue Jan 12, 2016 9:43 pm

1/12

                         Shelagh..

                                     Bravo ! It's true the USA has become weak under Obama !
 he doesn't  know not what he's doing , now Iran captured 10 American Navy sailors, just
 before he gave his last speech , he never mentioned it, he did slam the Republicans but
 we all know he's good at that, his legacy is " FAILURE," he's not a politician like Regan was
 Jimmy Carter was the same not a politician when Regan took over Iran handed over the 
 hostages they had for a year, shows you the difference.....Pray it'll be someone stronger
 just heard tonight Hillary is going down the tubes, 54% for Sanders, 39% for Hillary and
 the FBI are doing a further investigation into the Money Clinton is getting as campaign 
 funds through the Clinton Foundation, looks like the chickens have come home to roost !

                                                           Cheers................Joe........... Very Happy
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Tue Jan 12, 2016 11:19 pm

Respectfully disagree with your overall view, Joe.  A personal opinion is not validation; however I view criticism in a positive light.  It means that someone is doing something that triggers critical reaction.  Doing nothing may avoid criticism, but then nothing gets done nor does it get attention.  Caring means doing something even if that something is just talking about it as we are doing.  Saying nothing can mean that one just doesn’t give a shit.  There are world issues that people don't want to discuss for fear of being labelled.  Intimidation is a powerful tool and it is used.  The intimidation weapon continues to be used in the M.E.  Speaking out against injustice helps to bring attention to a problem.  The problem with the occupation in Palestine continues with no concrete action to stop it.  Will some event trigger a war that could have been prevented?  
Attention in Europe is currently focused on immigration.  Finding a scapegoat to place all blame is a normal reaction whereas it normally is a combination of events that lead to the crisis, i.e., what caused the people to flee and become refugees?  Who is to blame for that? How could anyone know in advance the number of people to be effected and where they would go?  Hindsight changes nothing.
It is now believed that the origin of ISIS was caused by America’s invasion of Iraq.  We know the cause from hindsight.  There is usually a trigger that sets things off.  History records what triggered the start of past world wars.  People demand immediate action and press the President to do something.  A good President must consider the reaction of any action he takes.  The period of evaluation/consideration is often viewed as inaction or doing nothing.
“What we learn from history is that we don’t learn from history” - a statement made by an historian and it rings true.
The immigration problem in Europe will eventually be resolved, however quick fixes don’t work.  Whatever actions are taken will have long-term effects.
The challenges ahead require intelligent, level-headed leaders.  Those seeking office make statements that appeal to the voter.  Unfortunately they are not held accountable once elected. 
It will be an interesting 2016.  We should voice our opinions and social media gives us that opportunity.  The input we receive affects our views.  There is a danger in relying on the media as our sole source of information.  An example of that is with those whose source of information is Fox News.
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Shelagh
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 5:08 am

Obama is weak. A strong president has the guts to say no just as firmly as saying yes. There are two ways of dealing with the problems in the Middle East: to stay out completely, or to go in with full force and take control. Staying out means leaving the region to sort out its own problems with no interference from the West. Sanctions on trade would hurt both sides, but eventually would impact more on the warring tribes in the Middle East than on the West. The long term solution would come at a cost of many lives lost before arriving at a peaceful settlement in the region.

Full force means a coalition of forces with the sanction of the UN to use as much force as is necessary to assume power over the warring tribes. The cost to human life would be much lower, but the financial cost would be much higher, since a military presence would be required for many years to keep the peace and stabilise the area.

Obama has done neither; he has dabbled in military intervention with catastrophic results for muslims, europeans and the rest of the world, which has become as volatile and unstable as at any time in previous history.

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 6:02 am

I agree with UN involvement.  No single country should take control and that includes America.  The UN was set up to deal with world problems.  They may not have the capability themselves, but with "united" approval, action can be taken to designate who should do what.  The UN is a coalition.  By using the UN no country can be singled out, good or bad.  The word "United" and "Nations" should mean something and not just be a gathering place to make speeches. To place the responsibility on America for not taking direct action is unfair.  Although they have acted in the past as the world's policeman, they are not that nor should they be.  It puts them into a situation that they are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 7:39 am

... but non-involvement of the USA would stymie an agreement among the other nations.

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:32 am

America is a part of the UN.  Let the world body decide and let them function united. Taking unilateral actions is not the answer.  People who take the path of peace are often referred to as "weak", yet that path is the toughest path to take.  IMV, bombing the hell out of people is the weak response. When someone has military might it takes much restraint not to use it except as a last resort.
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 2:49 pm

I agree about non-interference, but that means not supplying arms to the rebels, which America did. From the BBC:

"US President Barack Obama never seemed to want a train-and-equip programme for Syrian rebels. Now, government officials admit that the programme is pretty much over. Here's what happened behind the scenes at the White House.

After the uprising against President Bashar al-Assad in 2011, rooting for the rebels was, for many in the West, synonymous with rooting for democracy and freedom.

In the US, White House officials offered the rebels humanitarian aid and some military gear. But they argued over whether they should provide heavy weapons and help in a more serious way.

The philosophical discussion at the White House was heated and fierce, leading to stalemate, not resolution.

For years Obama and his deputies refused to say categorically: we're not doing this. Instead a decision was postponed.

Four years later, the result is a splintered Syrian opposition, the growth of the Islamic State group and a humanitarian disaster stretching across Europe."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-33997408

From the Economist:

"Mr Obama seeks to 'degrade and ultimately destroy' IS, but his military campaign has been half-hearted and is fatally flawed by the lack of a plan for Syria. He said he would train and equip a moderate Sunni force in Syria—to fight only IS, not Mr Assad. That notion was doomed from the start. It attracted only a pitiful number of recruits, and the first batch sent into Syria was all but annihilated. Now the White House says, in effect, that arming Syrian rebels was an idea foisted on Mr Obama, who never believed in it. Rarely has an American president so abjectly abandoned his global responsibility."

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21666612-americas-failure-intervene-earlier-leaves-no-good-options-helping-syria-doing-nothing

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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:07 pm

1/13

              Shelagh..

                               " BRAVO !," You tell it like it is ! This country is in very deep
trouble and the left liberal democrats are scared to death, we need change and we
need it fast and I don't mean Sanders or Hillary, people are fed up with the old
political ways...

                                                   Cheers.........Joe........ Very Happy
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:08 pm

Laughing
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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Thu Jan 14, 2016 7:22 am

1/14

                       Abe is smiling so I guess he agrees with us !

                                    Cheers....Joe...........
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Thu Jan 14, 2016 8:09 am

Evil or Very Mad
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:17 am

Latest development. 
Jews in Germany want to leave because they say there are too many Muslims in Germany.  Putin invited them to come to Russia. 
Form you own opinions about this.
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 20, 2016 3:26 am

Jews have integrated themselves into German culture, but they fear that muslims will resist integration and enforce their own culture, and thus change the balance of a predominantly German way of life. The fears of jews and non-jews in Germany are expressed here:

http://www.jta.org/2015/09/21/news-opinion/world/will-german-welcome-of-refugees-come-at-jews-expense

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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Wed Jan 20, 2016 4:05 am

Good article, Shelagh.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Sat Mar 12, 2016 9:06 am

Problems with migrants/refugees continue.  This past week a man was arrested for beating his wife.  When the police arrested him, he told the police that they can’t tell him what to do.  He said that he decides what is best for his wife.  That didn’t prevent his arrest.  Another more serious incident occurred where three Afghani men beat up an old man, robbed him and killed him.  They said that they wanted to start a new life in Germany and needed money.  They got 150 Euros.  These men will spend the rest of their lives in jail and the cost of jailing them for a lifetime is considerable.  Crime is on the rise primarily with the migrants/refugees.   Solving the problem remains an issue that is influencing elections that will take place tomorrow.
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joefrank
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Sat Mar 12, 2016 12:18 pm

3/12

            That's why the USA shouldn't take in any refugees....


                                        Joe.
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Abe F. March
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Sat Mar 12, 2016 12:42 pm

Wrong Joe.
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PostSubject: Re: Refugees/Migrants   Sat Mar 12, 2016 1:00 pm

On Obama's watch, refugees continue to be sent back to South America ... and that's okay, except when it's on Donald Trump's list of things to do.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/12/obama-immigration-deportations-central-america

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